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re: Rewatched the game.........
Posted on 1/2/13 at 2:36 pm to dgnx6
Posted on 1/2/13 at 2:36 pm to dgnx6
In our past two bowl games, when our opponent had a month to prepare, we had 5 & 9 first downs. Our opponents had 21 30' against our vaunted defense. This could mean a couple of things. Our coaches don't prepare the kids or game plan as well as other teams of these games or our def and offenses are inferior, by a lot, to our opponents. We can pick apart one play here and one play there, but the entire game needs to be viewed. Our outside running attack doesn't exist and the opponents know that (Shep). The passing attack is simple and still doesn't use the TE, and they know it. We have elite players at every position and 14 First downs in the two bowl games in front of national audience and future recruits.
0
Posted on 1/2/13 at 2:38 pm to jonanthans
quote:
Jeremy Hill had zero carries in the 4th quarter. Zero carries....
Thank you....Lets not forget that he was taken out of the game on both series following electrifying touchdown runs. I'm quite certain that Clemson's D was happy to see him on the sideline alot. No disrespect to Ford, Ware, and Hilliard but why shift gears when 33 is getting into a rhythm?
Posted on 1/2/13 at 2:47 pm to Bloodworth
And when are Stud and Krag going to set up and explain, for themselves, why we do not move the football? Take away the Hill run, when the Clemson buys we're still in the locker room, we have 160 yards of total offense! And that defense aint Bama!!
Posted on 1/2/13 at 2:47 pm to JawjaTigah
quote:
It's a real cluster...
We can all kige this
Posted on 1/2/13 at 2:53 pm to Thunder Tiger
quote:
quote:
Lucky arse heave by Boyd and yet another amazing catch by Hopkins gets them the first.
quote:
I still don't know how that kid made that catch.
Agree on both counts. In the replay from the quarterback's POV it looks like the ball is gonna hit Reid in the back until the very end. So frickin' frustrating.
I was an amazing throw and catch but I can promise you it wasnt a "lucky arse heave". Those two have been making plays like that for two years. Hopkins has some of the best hands I have ever seen. Kid snags almost anything in his area. Look at his TD against Auburn as a good example.
LINK
Posted on 1/2/13 at 2:54 pm to Thunder Tiger
good post--but I disagree on key drive with 2:41 left. Great pass to landry to set up a 2 and 2---RUN THE BALL!! Mett misses wide open play action(he almost could have lobbed the ball to him)--this makes it 3rd and 2--RUN THE BALL!!! If we run the ball on these 2 downs, a first down is a great probability, and clemson has to use timeouts.
the bottom line is that we had a chance to win, couldn't execute offensively when we had to, and completely forgot the running game--Hill had a great game, but only had 12 carries!!??!! defense got tired, and Les cant manage the clock and situations at the end of a game.
the bottom line is that we had a chance to win, couldn't execute offensively when we had to, and completely forgot the running game--Hill had a great game, but only had 12 carries!!??!! defense got tired, and Les cant manage the clock and situations at the end of a game.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 3:12 pm to Tiger Voodoo
I'm not player...never have been, never will be, and admittedly my technical knowledge is limited as a fan only. I'm interested to see from some of you how badly we were affected by Wing being out of the game...if he was in play, would we have accomplished anything better as far as putting Clemson in worse field position more frequently? Assuming Wing plays like he usually does....
Posted on 1/2/13 at 3:18 pm to shrevetiger53
The offense sucks. Too aggressive, to conservative, not executing right, now calling the right plays, not creative enough in schemes, not enough misdirection...I've got my theories, but feel free to take your pick. But no one can possibly believe that 219 net yards against a team that gives up 400 yards a game on average is acceptable.
We're supposed to be the number 8 team in the country and we barely break 200 yards on the 65th best defense in the league by yardage? More than half of our possessions end in a 3 and out?
Unacceptable, and there are people who get paid a lot of money to make it work and they need to be accountable.
We're supposed to be the number 8 team in the country and we barely break 200 yards on the 65th best defense in the league by yardage? More than half of our possessions end in a 3 and out?
Unacceptable, and there are people who get paid a lot of money to make it work and they need to be accountable.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 3:24 pm to lsutigerB
Punting was not an issue in the game. The kid stepped up. Not going to miss Wing.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 3:33 pm to PDTigerfan
quote:
Hopkins has some of the best hands I have ever seen. Kid snags almost anything in his area. Look at his TD against Auburn as a good example.
LINK
WOW! Almost as good as Landry's catch vs Arkansas. I say almost because Boyd actually made a spectacular throw to put the ball right over the db into Hopkins hands...while Landry had to leap and make a one handed grab of a not so perfectly thrown pass. Both showed out by staying in bounds at the boundaries.
Great link!
Posted on 1/2/13 at 3:58 pm to Tiger Voodoo
Thanks for the synopsis - that helps 
Posted on 1/2/13 at 6:25 pm to samaham
quote:
You have to be able to get 2 yards with 2 downs. This at the very least forces Clemson to use 2 timeouts
Yep...
Posted on 1/2/13 at 6:33 pm to Tiger Voodoo
Great post, 
Posted on 1/2/13 at 7:28 pm to Tiger Voodoo
Great post, thanks for the breakdown. I usually watch the game several times afterwards but my DVR screwed me this time. Since I watched the game at a party I wasn't able to give it my full attention but your breakdown matched the feelings I did get from my limited viewing.
I was very surprised at the problems our offensive line had handling Clemson's D-line, especially given that their line had shown next to nothing all year long. Did you notice anything special they were doing schematically? It did seem to me that their DE playing over Alexander was totally ignoring our first down play action fakes and blowing into the backfield wich I found a little odd...since I would expect most teams to heavily respect our run game given our past history. Any insight on this?
I was very surprised at the problems our offensive line had handling Clemson's D-line, especially given that their line had shown next to nothing all year long. Did you notice anything special they were doing schematically? It did seem to me that their DE playing over Alexander was totally ignoring our first down play action fakes and blowing into the backfield wich I found a little odd...since I would expect most teams to heavily respect our run game given our past history. Any insight on this?
Posted on 1/3/13 at 8:58 am to lsuexpert57
Man, just coming back to read this thread, and I have to say I'm pleasantly surprised at the rational discussion taking place. I thought I'd get a bunch of tldrs and Miles sucks responses, so thanks to everyone for taking the time to actually talk about the game.
The one thing I noticed was people getting hung up on the fact the Hill didn't have any carries in the 4th quarter. The way the game played out, it really wasn't that hard to see why.
His last carry was on the last play of the 3rd quarter, a 3rd and 2 run when he got stuffed for 1.
We punted on the first play of the 4th quarter and didn't get the ball back until there were 9:26 left in the game after a 13 play FG drive made it an 8 point game.
Ware runs for 3 on 1st, and I have NO problem with Ware getting series here. Dude is about as reliable as they come with ball security, hard running, and pass protection. Plus, he got his ankle rolled up pretty bad early in the 3rd and I was just happy to see he was OK.
We try a throw on 2nd and 7 when no one is open so we dump it off to Ware for -1, and on 3rd and 8, it's an obvious passing down. Unfortunately, the entire line gets blown up at the snap and Mett is sacked for #6 of the night.
Clemson then goes on an 11 play TD drive, and we don't have the ball again until 2:47 left in the game, up by 2.
This is virtually the EXACT same time that was left against Bama after Odell gets the big first down catch, when Miles went conservative and ran the ball 3 times when a first down ends the game. Everyone bashed him for going conservative, and he didn't do that this time.
At this point, Clemson still has all its timeouts, so we HAVE to get the first down. If we run three times and they use their timeouts, SO WHAT??? Bama didn't need a single TO to go 80 yards in under a minute. Clemson could have just as easily moved the ball with no timeouts and over a minute and a half, especially after our D had been worn down over 80 plays on the night and over 20 in the 4th alone.
Hill is in the game on this drive, but we get a GREAT play call to a WIDE OPEN Boone for 8 yards, and we're at 2nd and 2.
Obviously, the coaches have figured something out, and they see something they like and try to exploit. We get an absolutely PERFECT play call on 2nd and 2 with play action rollout and Jarvis is ALL ALONE in Clemson territory to end the game, and Mett simply shits the bed. I'm not blasting him, but he just didn't make the play that he should have.
Now, it's catastrophe syndrome all around. It feels like the Bama game all over again, and the coaches haven't forgotten their mistake in that one. We're almost at midfield with a 3rd and 2, with 1:45 to go and Clemson has all TOs. Running here just to make them spend 1 TO is completely stupid. You call the play that you think gets the 1st, you don't even consider TOs at this point because the coaches know as well as we do at home that our D is simply exhausted and can't go back on that field.
After 2 great play calls, the coaches think they have them figured out and Clemson will be thinking run, so they decide to give the players a second chance with a pass. Again, the pass play just doesn't work out. It's not a great play call IMO, but once again a Clemson player just makes the play and knocks the pass down after getting great pressure.
It sucks, but that's how it went down.
Watching that 4th quarter again is just surreal. You can't believe that the D is on the field as long as they were, but the bottom line is we just didn't have any time to set up any kind of rhythm on O, passing OR running after pretty much splitting 50/50 to equal success in the 3rd quarter after the first play.
Miles was aggressive and stuck with his QB, and I can respect that.
The one thing I noticed was people getting hung up on the fact the Hill didn't have any carries in the 4th quarter. The way the game played out, it really wasn't that hard to see why.
His last carry was on the last play of the 3rd quarter, a 3rd and 2 run when he got stuffed for 1.
We punted on the first play of the 4th quarter and didn't get the ball back until there were 9:26 left in the game after a 13 play FG drive made it an 8 point game.
Ware runs for 3 on 1st, and I have NO problem with Ware getting series here. Dude is about as reliable as they come with ball security, hard running, and pass protection. Plus, he got his ankle rolled up pretty bad early in the 3rd and I was just happy to see he was OK.
We try a throw on 2nd and 7 when no one is open so we dump it off to Ware for -1, and on 3rd and 8, it's an obvious passing down. Unfortunately, the entire line gets blown up at the snap and Mett is sacked for #6 of the night.
Clemson then goes on an 11 play TD drive, and we don't have the ball again until 2:47 left in the game, up by 2.
This is virtually the EXACT same time that was left against Bama after Odell gets the big first down catch, when Miles went conservative and ran the ball 3 times when a first down ends the game. Everyone bashed him for going conservative, and he didn't do that this time.
At this point, Clemson still has all its timeouts, so we HAVE to get the first down. If we run three times and they use their timeouts, SO WHAT??? Bama didn't need a single TO to go 80 yards in under a minute. Clemson could have just as easily moved the ball with no timeouts and over a minute and a half, especially after our D had been worn down over 80 plays on the night and over 20 in the 4th alone.
Hill is in the game on this drive, but we get a GREAT play call to a WIDE OPEN Boone for 8 yards, and we're at 2nd and 2.
Obviously, the coaches have figured something out, and they see something they like and try to exploit. We get an absolutely PERFECT play call on 2nd and 2 with play action rollout and Jarvis is ALL ALONE in Clemson territory to end the game, and Mett simply shits the bed. I'm not blasting him, but he just didn't make the play that he should have.
Now, it's catastrophe syndrome all around. It feels like the Bama game all over again, and the coaches haven't forgotten their mistake in that one. We're almost at midfield with a 3rd and 2, with 1:45 to go and Clemson has all TOs. Running here just to make them spend 1 TO is completely stupid. You call the play that you think gets the 1st, you don't even consider TOs at this point because the coaches know as well as we do at home that our D is simply exhausted and can't go back on that field.
After 2 great play calls, the coaches think they have them figured out and Clemson will be thinking run, so they decide to give the players a second chance with a pass. Again, the pass play just doesn't work out. It's not a great play call IMO, but once again a Clemson player just makes the play and knocks the pass down after getting great pressure.
It sucks, but that's how it went down.
Watching that 4th quarter again is just surreal. You can't believe that the D is on the field as long as they were, but the bottom line is we just didn't have any time to set up any kind of rhythm on O, passing OR running after pretty much splitting 50/50 to equal success in the 3rd quarter after the first play.
Miles was aggressive and stuck with his QB, and I can respect that.
This post was edited on 1/3/13 at 9:18 am
Posted on 1/3/13 at 9:10 am to Penrod
quote:
1) screens work against blitzes. They were often pressuring us with their front four or maybe one more.
Screens can work extremely well against DLs that are flying upfield, especially when LBs behind them are either in man or are in zone but aren't overly athletic (and Clemson's LBs aren't freaks of nature in space).
LSU refuses to implement a successful screen/draw game, though, so I don't know why this surprised anyone.
Posted on 1/3/13 at 9:14 am to Tiger Voodoo
Where was Hilliard on short yardage runs? Where was a combination of Hilliard and Hill. At least here the D has to account for both getting the ball. On second and two with Copeland in the game why does his 280lbs not touch the ball? Why does LSU show run against a 9 man front and run right into the teeth of it?
Posted on 1/3/13 at 9:16 am to Choupique19
quote:
You know what I got out of reading that? In your description, Every pass that was not completed in which there was a possible defensive interference on the play, and on the Mett interception, the routes were quick slants. That's right, about 5 times during the game we ran a basic quick slant route and expect college defensive backs to not be prepared to cover the route. It really was our go to route on the season, and opposing defenses could easily prepare for it and break it up. Our passing game is so simplistic and easy to defend.
The td pass to Landry, he faked the slant and cut back outside to get open.
That's a great point and I agree with all of it. I've said all year long the lack of a game breaking downfield threat really hurt what we were able to do on O. Ds could keep safeties in the box without much fear of getting burned over the top, and it made it extremely tough to execute anything we were trying to do.
It's actually makes some of the late success in the passing game even more impressive.
I have no doubt getting some of these young receivers in next year that can stretch the field will be a huge help.
And Mett should have more success throwing downfield to receivers that can actually separate from the coverage. I don't blame him for putting a little extra air under his deep balls when the DBs are almost step for step with our WRs. At least it won't get picked.
Sure there weren't many RR type deep TDs, but how many times did you see a WR running free the way RR could by breaking press coverage and getting behind the safety???
quote:
The interception was Mett's fault.
This is textbook, "Don't throw late over the middle of the field." You hear former quarterback turned analyst say this all of the time.
Agreed. I'm a Mett fan, but the receiver couldn't come back to that ball. It was a huge wall of Orange, and it only would have been 6-7 yard gain. Great play by the DB to make the catch, but throw it away 100%.
This post was edited on 1/3/13 at 9:17 am
Posted on 1/3/13 at 9:20 am to PDTigerfan
quote:
I was an amazing throw and catch but I can promise you it wasnt a "lucky arse heave". Those two have been making plays like that for two years. Hopkins has some of the best hands I have ever seen.
And as for my use of "lucky arse heave", I certainly meant no disrespect. I've said all along Clemson was a very good team and they deserved to win and Boyd and particularly Hopkins were phenomenal.
I just think Boyd was under pressure on what would have been the last play of the game and pretty much closed his eyes and threw it to a spot hoping Hopkins made the play. It was a heads up play and the only thing he could do, but it was pretty lucky that Hopkins made yet another great play.
Hell, the ball almost bounced off Reid's shoulder he was on him so tight. If Reid turns his head it's a pick and there's nothing Hopkins can do about it.
That said, every other play of the night Clemson earned (aside from several very favorable calls and no calls in key spots, but I'm not saying that's an excuse or cheapens Clemson's win).
It was a great game and I just wish we could have pulled it out in the end.
Here's hoping we get a chance to meet up again soon. Would LOVE a home and home with yall
This post was edited on 1/3/13 at 9:21 am
Posted on 1/3/13 at 9:57 am to Tiger Voodoo
Great summary. I agree on most except LSU's o-line. Man its hard to have any pocket presence when you are getting sacked from behind. I have never played QB but im pretty sure its the last place you expect to be hit from. Mett did hold the ball a tad to long on a few plays but im sure he was expecting better blocking. O-line run blocking seemed pretty damn good from what i recall, pass blocking not so much, even mom asked if the o-line was pissed at mett lol. I also loved our new punter, wished he could have had a chance to fake it. Also didnt see much of the old mad hatter in les, no trick plays, no going for it, i thought he would have had gone for it more on 4th and short when LSU was inside the 10. All and all a great game marred by bad officiating and Clemson played lights out. Clemsons receiver had like 800 yds, or at least it felt that way and their pass D was damn good. I loved the play calling, but just like the bama bcsncg, when something aint working then go with what you do best. Run and more run with some trickery.
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