- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Winter Olympics
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: Knowshon Moreno examples
Posted on 3/12/09 at 7:30 pm to RelocatedPelican
Posted on 3/12/09 at 7:30 pm to RelocatedPelican
If you don't think Bush is athletic then you are a fricking moron.
Bush's problem is that he's a bitch and he doesn't see the field as well as great RBs.
His athleticism is the reason he lead the league in TDs before he got hurt.
Bush's problem is that he's a bitch and he doesn't see the field as well as great RBs.
His athleticism is the reason he lead the league in TDs before he got hurt.
1
Posted on 3/12/09 at 8:24 pm to LSUtigahs28
quote:
His athleticism is the reason he lead the league in TDs before he got hurt.
+1
Drafting KM
This post was edited on 3/12/09 at 8:25 pm
Posted on 3/12/09 at 8:45 pm to SaintLSUnAtl
quote:
Whether this was meant as a joke or not, this might be the most intelligent post in Saints Board history.
Meant every word
RB @ 14 theory =
Posted on 3/12/09 at 8:48 pm to xrockfordf150x
Last year Bush was starting to be the RB Payton wants in his STYLE of offense. He was leading the league in TD's before he got hurt plus he is an immediate HOMERUN threat as soon as he hits the field....the only position that we should draft on offense is the line other than that is D all the way
This post was edited on 3/12/09 at 8:49 pm
Posted on 3/12/09 at 10:38 pm to Big D of the LC
Now these are funny. Bush is FAST and can make a cut, but he lacks the stop & go, spin, and upper body strength / arm usage KM has. You can't show any better highlights of Bush, bc there are none - Bush's USC running is summed up as 'run wide, run fast'. His hurdle with the Saints pales to KM. Please, at least try if you're going to refute KM >>> Bush.
If Bush would take the paycut he deserves to play a slot & return man, then great! But at his money and lined up at RB, he blows. Bush had TWO rushing TDs through week 7, period. When it comes to receiving out of the backfield, KM can do that just as well; Bush standouts as that slot / end-around / returner type - not a RB.
Not taking Moreno means yet another disappointing 1st round pick ( unless its Curry ) and another sickening season running the ball. Defense wins championships, no question, but so does a running game. The Cards didn't win last year - Pitt did. And the Cards didn't win late in the season and did so in the playoffs thanks to a nice running game. Anyone with any football knowledge knows that's historically the two most important aspects of the game - stopping the run and successfully running the ball.
If Bush would take the paycut he deserves to play a slot & return man, then great! But at his money and lined up at RB, he blows. Bush had TWO rushing TDs through week 7, period. When it comes to receiving out of the backfield, KM can do that just as well; Bush standouts as that slot / end-around / returner type - not a RB.
Not taking Moreno means yet another disappointing 1st round pick ( unless its Curry ) and another sickening season running the ball. Defense wins championships, no question, but so does a running game. The Cards didn't win last year - Pitt did. And the Cards didn't win late in the season and did so in the playoffs thanks to a nice running game. Anyone with any football knowledge knows that's historically the two most important aspects of the game - stopping the run and successfully running the ball.
Posted on 3/12/09 at 11:07 pm to RelocatedPelican
dewd, give it up.
That's your opinion but realize it is a vast majority that think otherwise.
-Bush is gonna be there this year no matter how much you rant on a message board. This is his make or break year with his contract. If he doesn't pan then this time next year it might be a reasonable discussion.
-Moreno doesn't rate #14 at all either. Find me one projection that has him that high and I'll show you 10 that have him at #24 or later. Trade down ten spots then he or Wells might be a consideration.
-Anyone else but Curry or Moreno will be a disappointing #14??? That doesn't deserve response
That's your opinion but realize it is a vast majority that think otherwise.
-Bush is gonna be there this year no matter how much you rant on a message board. This is his make or break year with his contract. If he doesn't pan then this time next year it might be a reasonable discussion.
-Moreno doesn't rate #14 at all either. Find me one projection that has him that high and I'll show you 10 that have him at #24 or later. Trade down ten spots then he or Wells might be a consideration.
-Anyone else but Curry or Moreno will be a disappointing #14??? That doesn't deserve response
Posted on 3/12/09 at 11:08 pm to RelocatedPelican
quote:
Now these are funny. Bush is FAST and can make a cut, but he lacks the stop & go, spin, and upper body strength / arm usage KM has. You can't show any better highlights of Bush, bc there are none - Bush's USC running is summed up as 'run wide, run fast'. His hurdle with the Saints pales to KM. Please, at least try if you're going to refute KM >>> Bush.
If Bush would take the paycut he deserves to play a slot & return man, then great! But at his money and lined up at RB, he blows. Bush had TWO rushing TDs through week 7, period. When it comes to receiving out of the backfield, KM can do that just as well; Bush standouts as that slot / end-around / returner type - not a RB.
Not taking Moreno means yet another disappointing 1st round pick ( unless its Curry ) and another sickening season running the ball. Defense wins championships, no question, but so does a running game. The Cards didn't win last year - Pitt did. And the Cards didn't win late in the season and did so in the playoffs thanks to a nice running game. Anyone with any football knowledge knows that's historically the two most important aspects of the game - stopping the run and successfully running the ball.
This post is so retarded that its clear youre not fully functional so I wont try to correct you.
Posted on 3/13/09 at 12:06 am to RelocatedPelican
quote:
This post is so retarded that its clear youre not fully functional so I wont try to correct you
I'll try.
quote:
Now these are funny. Bush is FAST and can make a cut, but he lacks the stop & go, spin, and upper body strength / arm usage KM has.
You are a fricking idiot. Show me footage of where KM has done any of this IN THE NFL and show me footage of Bush in the NFL... you are trying to compare a college player to an NFL player. You just can not do that. And show me a picture of KM's upper body being ANYWHERE REMOTELY close to Bush's...
quote:
His hurdle with the Saints pales to KM
You are full of shite. Bush's hurdle this year was better than any ive seen from moreno. And wtf does one hurdle that KM did in college compare to anything Bush has done in the NFL. Just stop.
quote:
Not taking Moreno means yet another disappointing 1st round pick
Quit posting please. We do not need a RB. Our offense is #1 without a Brandon Jacobs, or Clinton Portis, or Adrian Peterson. What we need is defense.
quote:
Defense wins championships, no question, but so does a running game.
Defense >>>>>>> Running the ball with a small RB(KM). Our OL couldnt block for Brandon frickin Jacobs, not to mention Bush...
quote:
The Cards didn't win last year - Pitt did.
No fricking shite. Do you know why? they had the best defensive unit in the past decade. Not one of the top 10 RB's in the league...
quote:
Anyone with any football knowledge knows that's historically the two most important aspects of the game - stopping the run and successfully running the ball.
Notice what you said first, STOPPING THE RUN. This part is correct. Idk if you knew that stopping the run was an objective of the DEFENSE, not the running offense. You are just confusing yourself even more.
This post was edited on 3/13/09 at 12:07 am
Posted on 3/13/09 at 12:18 am to blueslover
Just because a number of folks think different doesn't mean one should conform - I bet I can find 20 people that want a WR in that pick and I bet if I try hard enough, a few that want a TE or a FB.
Some folks love Bush because they see the good side, but they are blind to the bad ( didn't even get into his fumbling issues ). They see 'leading the league in TDs!' and don't see only 2 are from actually running the ball, because they don't want to. They see PT run all over KC or the Lions, who everyone ran all over on. Anyways...
For the Saints, at pick 14, to have the most impact, it truly is Curry or Moreno. The Saints surely could draft someone else there, but they won't be getting the most impact for the pick ( ex. BJ looks like a terrific DT, but that doesn't help the Saints as much as a RB or S ).
I agree that trading down to 20 and grabbing Moreno would be terrific; I even listed it in the thread on trading down. Getting rid of Bush or restructuring his contract won't happen till next year, but that doesn't mean the Saints should wait to replace him with a real RB.
Moreno doesn't rate at 14? Please. Rating is a matter of player value + position value + team need, all relative information. Hell even Kiper has Moreno to the Saints now. As much as I think the guy is whacked on many occasions, he's got one of the better predictions records out there.
Some folks love Bush because they see the good side, but they are blind to the bad ( didn't even get into his fumbling issues ). They see 'leading the league in TDs!' and don't see only 2 are from actually running the ball, because they don't want to. They see PT run all over KC or the Lions, who everyone ran all over on. Anyways...
For the Saints, at pick 14, to have the most impact, it truly is Curry or Moreno. The Saints surely could draft someone else there, but they won't be getting the most impact for the pick ( ex. BJ looks like a terrific DT, but that doesn't help the Saints as much as a RB or S ).
I agree that trading down to 20 and grabbing Moreno would be terrific; I even listed it in the thread on trading down. Getting rid of Bush or restructuring his contract won't happen till next year, but that doesn't mean the Saints should wait to replace him with a real RB.
Moreno doesn't rate at 14? Please. Rating is a matter of player value + position value + team need, all relative information. Hell even Kiper has Moreno to the Saints now. As much as I think the guy is whacked on many occasions, he's got one of the better predictions records out there.
Posted on 3/13/09 at 1:05 am to RelocatedPelican
quote:
They see 'leading the league in TDs!' and don't see only 2 are from actually running the ball, because they don't want to.
WAIT..... i forgot that b/c, they arent rushing td's... he is not valuable to the offense.... yea your right... he isnt a threat...
Besides....receiving td's as a running back dont count anyways..
This post was edited on 3/13/09 at 1:06 am
Posted on 3/13/09 at 1:26 am to SaintLSUnAtl
Don't know why everybody is bashing the dude, he udbacyuqllu making some good points. I still think 14 is to high for moreno but he wouldn't be a bad player in the saints system. You people are also talking about taking a defensive player but not giving an opinion on who to take. The defense only really nears help at linebacker and safety and none are worth taking at 14 because curry will be gone. Cushing, Matthews, Moore at 14 would be major reaches.
Posted on 3/13/09 at 1:29 am to thedice20
quote:
His hurdle with the Saints pales to KM.
a 4yrd leap into paydirt over a steeler fails to compare to Moreno leAping over a slightly crouched defender which he then falls down after he lands and only picks up an extra 2yrds (somebody said it earlier, this may be the most overhyped highlight ever)
LINK
And if that was Reggie he wouldnt be dumb enough to jump over the player..IF Bush was 1 on 1 with the player in the open field he would have shook the frick out of him and he still be running
quote:
Not taking Moreno means yet another disappointing 1st round pick ( unless its Curry ) and another sickening season running the ball.
Taking Moreno would be a huge dissapointment since we are a good offense and bad on defense--but u fail to realize that because your so far up Moreno's arse
quote:
The Cards didn't win last year - Pitt did.
Thanks genius but Arizona still had every opportunity to win but Arizona's defense blew it and Big Ben does gets props because he engineered a great drive
quote:
Defense wins championships, no question, but so does a running game.
Really?
Pitt ranked 23rd in rushing stats and Arizona ranked 32..Neither's Running attack was even relevant in the Superbowl(and not really relevant during the season) it was the passing game...Also Arizona got as far as they did because their defense played better and gave their offense enough help to win games in the playoffs
But good argument
This post was edited on 3/13/09 at 1:41 am
Posted on 3/13/09 at 2:10 am to CM84
Not that it matters but here's Reggie jumping over a defender, if thats how this guy measures athleticism.
Posted on 3/13/09 at 3:20 am to LDBaby
quote:
Don't know why everybody is bashing the dude, he udbacyuqllu making some good points.
If you say Reggie isn't athletic then you are a fricking moron and should be barred from procreating.
Posted on 3/13/09 at 3:55 am to RelocatedPelican
quote:
Defense wins championships, no question, but so does a running game.
The Steelers really didn't do much in the running game against AZ. They won b/c of the interception in the endzone, Hines Ward playing like Hines Ward, and Santonio Holmes having the game of his career. It also doesn't help that DRC dropped 3 possible interceptions. I was impressed on how fast he can get into position but INT's would have been so much nicer than PD's.
Posted on 3/13/09 at 8:56 am to LDBaby
I can't go more on the RB-Moreno debate, a little bit too much man love involved.
Obviously you haven't read my draft talk posts
Cushing in no reach, you can find many projections of him already gone at #14 and most no lower than early 20's. I disagree also, DT may not cry need as loudly but another young dominant DT could make this D's future very bright. You can never have enough CBs either. McKenzie is on his last legs if there at all. Porter only has 5 games experience. Gay and JD are just role players.
Who's great value at 14 on D-
Curry- no way in hell
Raji- extremely unlikely
Orakpo- more 3-4 suited but could 4-3DE
Everette Brown- a can't pass BPA
Cushing- need/rank match, not a fave of mine
Jenkins- win either way CB or FS
Who's no reach in range at 14-
Peria Jerry- Ellis/Jerry team A+
Vontae Davis- great CB competition then (FS potential also)
Maybin- most have 3-4 but can do 4-3 IMO
Maualuga- going down on most charts, ILB only so no
Reaches I wouldn't be upset with at 14-
Alphonso Smith
Sean Smith- if they grade him as a FS star especially
Darius Butler
quote:
You people are also talking about taking a defensive player but not giving an opinion on who to take. The defense only really nears help at linebacker and safety and none are worth taking at 14 because curry will be gone. Cushing, Matthews, Moore at 14 would be major reaches.
Obviously you haven't read my draft talk posts
Cushing in no reach, you can find many projections of him already gone at #14 and most no lower than early 20's. I disagree also, DT may not cry need as loudly but another young dominant DT could make this D's future very bright. You can never have enough CBs either. McKenzie is on his last legs if there at all. Porter only has 5 games experience. Gay and JD are just role players.
Who's great value at 14 on D-
Curry- no way in hell
Raji- extremely unlikely
Orakpo- more 3-4 suited but could 4-3DE
Everette Brown- a can't pass BPA
Cushing- need/rank match, not a fave of mine
Jenkins- win either way CB or FS
Who's no reach in range at 14-
Peria Jerry- Ellis/Jerry team A+
Vontae Davis- great CB competition then (FS potential also)
Maybin- most have 3-4 but can do 4-3 IMO
Maualuga- going down on most charts, ILB only so no
Reaches I wouldn't be upset with at 14-
Alphonso Smith
Sean Smith- if they grade him as a FS star especially
Darius Butler
This post was edited on 3/13/09 at 9:11 am
Posted on 3/13/09 at 9:27 am to HeauxBeaux
"Why people don't understand why people don't realize bush gives defenses fits. "
This is my point exactly, ill give one example. Has anyone else noticed that when Reggie catches a swing pass there is at least one defensive player ready to unload on him? And when PT runs the same play he gets to the seconardy before he has to avoid anyone?
This is my point exactly, ill give one example. Has anyone else noticed that when Reggie catches a swing pass there is at least one defensive player ready to unload on him? And when PT runs the same play he gets to the seconardy before he has to avoid anyone?
Posted on 3/13/09 at 10:02 am to Telephone Tough Guy
Pitt averaged 105.6 (#23) rushing yards per game with more injuries at RB than you can shake a stick at, to Arizona's 73.6 (#32), while allowing 80.3 (#2) vs 110.3 (#16). In the game, Pitt had 20 carries for 59 yds vs 10 carries for 33 - neither great, but holds to the course nonetheless. For the record, New Orleans is #28 @ 99.6 per game.
No one said Reggie isn't atheletic - he most certainly is. What I said was Moreno is more so. Reggie is faster and both can catch. Moreno leaps better or at worse, equal to Bush ( watch the clips in the OP or youtube his hurdles or dives for the endzone ). Reggie has great change of direction up to ~45 degree angles, whereas Moreno is closer to 60 ( again, look at the clips instead of just retorting ), has a great spin move plus a better stiff arm. The most important aspect, however, is running in traffic, which KM does well. Reggie either lacks the vision to find those lanes as he always bounces out wide, or worse, he's scared to stick his head in there.
If you like Reggie, great, go for it. But please do put it in perspective - its no secret, even to the biggest mancrush Bush fan, that Reggie is great at returning kicks & receiving the ball, but not running it. Moreno is a better RB, easily. And in case folks think I'm just a 'Reggie hater', let me make it clear - I hate Reggie lined up as a RB, but think he's fantastic as a returner or slot, almost wing back type of player. If the Saints could get Moreno and keep Reggie at that sort of position ( for that sort of money ), terrific!
Edit: FWIW, SI sees KM as a short yardage capable back as well:
No one said Reggie isn't atheletic - he most certainly is. What I said was Moreno is more so. Reggie is faster and both can catch. Moreno leaps better or at worse, equal to Bush ( watch the clips in the OP or youtube his hurdles or dives for the endzone ). Reggie has great change of direction up to ~45 degree angles, whereas Moreno is closer to 60 ( again, look at the clips instead of just retorting ), has a great spin move plus a better stiff arm. The most important aspect, however, is running in traffic, which KM does well. Reggie either lacks the vision to find those lanes as he always bounces out wide, or worse, he's scared to stick his head in there.
If you like Reggie, great, go for it. But please do put it in perspective - its no secret, even to the biggest mancrush Bush fan, that Reggie is great at returning kicks & receiving the ball, but not running it. Moreno is a better RB, easily. And in case folks think I'm just a 'Reggie hater', let me make it clear - I hate Reggie lined up as a RB, but think he's fantastic as a returner or slot, almost wing back type of player. If the Saints could get Moreno and keep Reggie at that sort of position ( for that sort of money ), terrific!
Edit: FWIW, SI sees KM as a short yardage capable back as well:
quote:
21 RB Knowshon Moreno Georgia Jr.
The Eagles need to come away from the first round with a running back and an offensive tackle to show for their two picks, and while running backs have a tendency to slide some in the opening round, Moreno might not last until No. 28. He and Connecticut's Donald Brown are both good pass-catchers who can pick up the blitz and handle short-yardage situations.
This post was edited on 3/13/09 at 10:14 am
Posted on 3/13/09 at 11:33 am to RelocatedPelican
RelocatedPelican?
This was one of your arguments or statements earlier, which i agreee with stopping the run but my argument is last year teams without great running games were in the superbowl
ANd then you basically contradict your whole argument and the stats show u dont have to run the ball consistently to win..Pitt had a bunch of injuries and they still won games without a good running game-Do u even kno the point you're argueing anymore??
quote:
Anyone with any football knowledge knows that's historically the two most important aspects of the game - stopping the run and successfully running the ball
This was one of your arguments or statements earlier, which i agreee with stopping the run but my argument is last year teams without great running games were in the superbowl
quote:
Pitt averaged 105.6 (#23) rushing yards per game with more injuries at RB than you can shake a stick at, to Arizona's 73.6 (#32), while allowing 80.3 (#2) vs 110.3 (#16). In the game, Pitt had 20 carries for 59 yds vs 10 carries for 33 - neither great, but holds to the course nonetheless. For the record, New Orleans is #28 @ 99.6 per game.
ANd then you basically contradict your whole argument and the stats show u dont have to run the ball consistently to win..Pitt had a bunch of injuries and they still won games without a good running game-Do u even kno the point you're argueing anymore??
Posted on 3/13/09 at 11:46 am to RelocatedPelican
quote:
Pitt averaged 105.6 (#23) rushing yards per game with more injuries at RB than you can shake a stick at, to Arizona's 73.6 (#32), while allowing 80.3 (#2) vs 110.3 (#16). In the game, Pitt had 20 carries for 59 yds vs 10 carries for 33 - neither great, but holds to the course nonetheless. For the record, New Orleans is #28 @ 99.6 per game.
So basically what you are saying is that a shitty running game is a good way to get to the SB, amirite?
quote:
No one said Reggie isn't atheletic - he most certainly is. What I said was Moreno is more so. Reggie is faster and both can catch. Moreno leaps better or at worse, equal to Bush ( watch the clips in the OP or youtube his hurdles or dives for the endzone ). Reggie has great change of direction up to ~45 degree angles, whereas Moreno is closer to 60 ( again, look at the clips instead of just retorting ), has a great spin move plus a better stiff arm. The most important aspect, however, is running in traffic, which KM does well. Reggie either lacks the vision to find those lanes as he always bounces out wide, or worse, he's scared to stick his head in there.
Retardation. This isn't the rant. We try to have rational thoughts and discussion.
quote:
its no secret, even to the biggest mancrush Bush fan
I'm far from a Bush mancrush fan. He has been a disappointment and seriously needs to work on his desire to go up the middle and his vision.
However you are a moron.
Page 2 of 5
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News