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re: Noah had dinosaurs on the Ark...
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:23 pm to bayoubengals88
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:23 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
Science has no answer for the biggest questions in life, so here we are.
We do have a pretty good fix on the longevity of human beings, and Noah was about four times as old as any person currently alive when he started constructing the Ark and was about 950 when he died.
Life expectancy has not decreased through the millennia. It has increased. It is grossly illogical to believe that someone from the Bronze Age lived to be that old.
If you want to believe that God sustained biblical figures like Noah and Methuselah to these amazing ages, that is fine. Like I said in my first post, I have no counter to miracles. If someone else says he spent a week exploring the deepest depths of the Pacific Ocean in a bubble created by Poseidon, I have no answer to that either.
quote:
Because it’s not to be taken literal Highly doubtful that those ages were in solar years
Plenty of Christians would disagree with you. In any case, Noah’s age is hardly my only criticism of the story. It’s just the first thing I would question when someone started a story by saying, “So this 500-year-old man…”
1
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:26 pm to Globetrotter747
quote:Why are you applying modern conceptions of time to 4,000 year old literature? This is a non issue.
It is grossly illogical to believe that someone from the Bronze Age lived to be that old.
quote:I'm not terribly interested in it.
If you want to believe that God sustained biblical figures like Noah and Methuselah to these amazing ages, that is fine
-----
Great evasion btw. Houdini like stuff!
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:26 pm to Lonnie Utah
quote:
I guess the good news for us Christians is how we personally interpret Genesis 1 doesn't have an effect on our eternal salvation....
I always find statements like this fascinating… If someone does not believe the Genesis account, it raises a genuine question. Do they truly believe Jesus is the Son of God? Jesus clearly treated Genesis as historical truth. He referenced it multiple times, including when he spoke of Noah as a real person and described the flood as an actual event that destroyed everyone except those on the Ark.
Jesus also refers to the blood of Abel, the son of Adam and Eve, identifying him as a real person whose murder marked the beginning of human violence. Once again, Jesus speaks of early Genesis figures as historical.
If Jesus himself treated Genesis as literal history, then it is reasonable to ask why any follower of Christ would take a different view. Surely no believer would claim that Jesus was mistaken, intentionally mislead his followers, or suggest that he was not telling the truth.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:32 pm to SallysHuman
quote:
I lived in the CSRA from 97-2000, visit there constantly the past 25yrs, and never have I ever had this happen...
I am sure this is so but I would suggest its because you weren't put off by it. I drive by at least 30 churches on my commute to work. At least half of them have a sign with a message on it about their beliefs. Most of them are very benign but they exist. There are 5 with signs between our house and my daughters high school....2 adjacent to the school. They also have signs with messages that they are bent on passing onto to the public. I would never suggest that this should be illegal or something BUT it is very intrusive...if the message is strong enough it is unlikely to go unheard in the south and it will stand on its own merit...the only plausible excuse is they are recruiting or, to use an ugly term, grooming.
Its also highly likely that if I am out in a public park in our area, sitting on a bench with my wife or family, that someone will approach us and start talking about their beliefs. It is not as bad here as it was in Athens but it does happen frequently. Again, it is harmless for the most part, but it is also somewhat insulting in that were I to do the same thing based on my beliefs I would fully expect a father to punch me in the nose LOL.
And finally it is hard to imagine living anywhere where the Jehovahs witnesses won't come knocking on your door to share their beliefs.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:38 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
I find Jesus to be the best source for what is right and what is wrong. Western Society does too. See human rights.
So, why not?!
I could not agree more. The teachings of MOST religions are, at their base, the ideal way for man to conduct his affairs in life. I am not aware of any in existence today on any scale that are outside the norm of common decency. That said the issue I do have is the high number of people who will agree with that statement while their actions bely their commitment.
I do not think these ideas came from god though, I think it is the foundational element of the decent human heart regardless of race, creed, nationality, name it....we all know how we wish to be treated and most of us try to treat people in like fashion...I don't know that our crudest instincts would not predominate, however, without our collectively expecting this of one another more often than not and religion certainly makes that possible.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:39 pm to AwgustaDawg
quote:
AwgustaDawg
Those messages are no worse than all of the Lion's Den billboards littering i20.
quote:
the only plausible excuse is they are recruiting or, to use an ugly term, grooming.
Churches with messages on their signs isn't "grooming".
I don't know why you're an atheist, I can understand that being one makes those church signs uncomfortable for you.
Do you use them as a conversation starter with your daughter on what you think of them? I have a high school son and we certainly have had conversations about advertisements that aren't inline with our values.
quote:
but it is also somewhat insulting in that were I to do the same thing based on my beliefs I would fully expect a father to punch me in the nose LOL.
I dunno... I don't mind talking to atheists, Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses or any other belief system that doesn't align with my own- many of my Christian brethren welcome such discussions.
quote:
And finally it is hard to imagine living anywhere where the Jehovahs witnesses won't come knocking on your door to share their beliefs.
Yeah, I've got those in the midlands too... even made a good friend with one, but she died a ways back. Offer them a water bottle or a popsicle and send them on their merry way.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:39 pm to cssamerican
quote:This is a fine argument, but how do we know he took it literally, and does it matter?
If Jesus himself treated Genesis as literal history, then it is reasonable to ask why any follower of Christ would take a different view.
He used the OT like it should be used—to point to himself.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:43 pm to cssamerican
quote:
If Jesus himself treated Genesis as literal history, then it is reasonable to ask why any follower of Christ would take a different view. Surely no believer would claim that Jesus was mistaken, intentionally mislead his followers, or suggest that he was not telling the truth.
This is where I'm at...
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:44 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
Why are you applying modern conceptions of time to 4,000 year old literature? This is a non issue.
What could be considered an issue in the eyes of a skeptic then? That a Noah of reasonable age rounded up a pair of every species on the planet in a wooden boat in the Middle East?
quote:
Great evasion btw. Houdini like stuff!
There are so many conflicting viewpoints on Noah’s Ark that I don’t even know where to begin. Some Christians believe the whole thing is literal. Some believe it’s figurative.
You would think God might clarify some of these things for the world.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:47 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
This is a fine argument, but how do we know he took it literally, and does it matter?
The only way we can 'know' is by what He said... does it matter? I dunno, but if I believe what Christ says then that leads me to believe what he seemingly believed and spoke on.
I think that there is room for various interpretations and salvation though.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:48 pm to Globetrotter747
quote:
You would think God might clarify some of these things for the world.
He put it in a book for us, what more do you want?
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:52 pm to Globetrotter747
quote:
You would think God might clarify some of these things for the world.
He did…
Mathew 24:37-39 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark. And they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:56 pm to AwgustaDawg
quote:
I do not think these ideas came from god though, I think it is the foundational element of the decent human heart regardless of race, creed, nationality, name it....we all know how we wish to be treated and most of us try to treat people in like fashion
You may think that way because you swim in Christian waters. The best of societies before the Christian revolution were brutal and grotesque, structured around power, not love.
Jesus changed that.
It’s quite astonishing.
This post was edited on 7/16/25 at 1:58 pm
Posted on 7/16/25 at 1:59 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
You may think that way because you swim in Christian waters. The best of societies before the Christian revolution were brutal and grotesque, structured around power, not love.
Very good point!
Posted on 7/16/25 at 2:05 pm to SallysHuman
quote:I would go further than this and say that he came to earth in the form of a man and physically, actually, died for us out of love. Jesus is the true Word of God. The biblical canon points to him.
He put it in a book for us, what more do you want?
Posted on 7/16/25 at 2:07 pm to cssamerican
quote:I just see that as using what's familiar to make a point. Everyone he spoke to would have grown up knowing such a story.
Mathew 24:37-39 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark. And they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 2:07 pm to bayoubengals88
quote:
Jesus is the true Word of God. The biblical canon points to him.
Agreed!
Posted on 7/16/25 at 2:13 pm to SallysHuman
quote:
He put it in a book for us, what more do you want?
A book I would say even most Christians haven’t really read completely. Most are just indoctrinated at a young age.
quote:
I would go further than this and say that he came to earth in the form of a man and physically, actually, died for us out of love. Jesus is the true Word of God. The biblical canon points to him.
I have been to the Holy Land. I have been to where Jesus was supposedly born, baptized, ate the Last Supper, arrested, executed, and resurrected.
It baffles me how crazy that part of the world is even today - and yet people believe stories of messiah figures in the area going back thousands of years.
I will never understand it.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 2:19 pm to Globetrotter747
quote:
A book I would say even most Christians haven’t really read completely. Most are just indoctrinated at a young age.
Well, whether people read it or not, it's there... which was in answer to your seeking clarification. Some people haven't read it, some interpret it literally, some interpret it as 'a story'- but the words are there to be read by any and all. The words don't change.
Posted on 7/16/25 at 2:20 pm to Globetrotter747
quote:That's ok man. But the evidence abounds.
I will never understand it.
quote:Only one of them has been successfull in gathering 1/3 of the world's population. He's truth itself.
and yet people believe stories of messiah figures in the area going back thousands of years.
This post was edited on 7/16/25 at 2:24 pm
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