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Posted on 9/25/22 at 6:51 am to Indefatigable
quote:
Are you saying that nuclear-capable missiles, the warheads themselves, their fuel, etc. do not have to be well maintained in order to function?
I realize its a "triad" system, but the silos themselves, you do realize they are in terrible shape? 60 minutes did a segment on them some time back, large bomb proof doors propped open because they were falling off the hinges, etc, who knows the condition of the missiles and launch systems themselves.
And personnel wise, I know they ran live drills a while back and many crews could not even get them prepared to launch in the time designated...long before russian supersonic missiles.
Heck congress even designated money to upgrade them but that probably went to sensitivity training.
Posted on 9/25/22 at 6:54 am to AU86
quote:
The moment that sob uses a tactical nuke in Ukraine he is a dead man. He is going to have NATO coming up his arse. The Russian Army is so bad, they are getting their asses handed to them by Ukraine; just imagine what the full force if NATO would do. This war has exposed the big bad Red Army.
There is no NATO. Germany spends 50 billion a year on their military, we left more bullets than that in Afghanistan. Russia could run over Europe in less time than Germany did.
Posted on 9/25/22 at 7:07 am to CitizenK
quote:
Most of the money is going to pay for troop deployment by the US in Poland due Putain's sabre rattling.
We have sent 3,000 additional troops to Poland and spend nearly 50 billion....thats 16.6 million per ticket to send a soldier by rail to Poland
Posted on 9/25/22 at 7:13 am to NC_Tigah
quote:
quote:
russia invaded ukraine unprovoked.
Wow!
Three sides hold blame ... NATO, Ukraine, and Russia.
War is hell. This one was 100% avoidable. Putin stated every way humanly possible that NATO in Ukraine posed an unacceptable threat to Russia. He made his case. He made it well ... for 20 years or more.
Barack Obama ignored Putin's concerns. Obama staged a Soros organized coup in Ukraine to insert a west-friendly government. That in turn restarted Ukraine-to-NATO dialogue. Snap! Putin walked into Crimea in response.
Obama and Ukraine STFU about NATO, and Putin was quiescent. Trump recognized NATO in Ukraine as all risk, no reward. There was no push for NATO in Ukraine, and no trouble from Putin.
Biden and Boris Johnson rekindled NATO dialogue. Ukraine swallowed the fantasy hook, line, and sinker. Putin warned FAAFO. Biden goaded him with leaked Ukraine-to-NATO negotiations. Putin did exactly what he'd warned he'd do.
Putin is like a rattlesnake on a forest trail. Ukraine was hiking down the trail with NATO. They came across the snake. It coiled and rattled, sensing a threat. NATO told the rattler "Calm down! We won't hurt you. Just move aside. We have every right to walk this path." Then nudged Ukraine forward. The snake struck. Ukraine got bitten.
You're blaming the snake.
Meanwhile, you imply those who don't blame the snake are somehow allied with or in love with rattlesnakes, or that we trust them? Obviously that is not the case.
Deal with facts as they lie rather than lying about the facts
This, this, and this.
And now Putin is clearly and unequivocally telling the west if you attack Russia all bets are off.
So you go ahead and continue to provoke him. He can then put a tactical nuke on Germany and dare the friggin US to do something because the rest are heading our way. All because some people decided millions in their bank account was not enough.
Posted on 9/25/22 at 7:17 am to Kentucker
quote:
When there’s a snake on the path you want to walk, you don’t turn around and go back home. You either get the snake off the path or kill it.
Snakes don’t own paths.
At least name the source of the quote, I think it was Custer before Little Big Horn wasnt it????
Posted on 9/25/22 at 7:22 am to NC_Tigah
quote:
quote:
quote:
Putin stated every way humanly possible that NATO in Ukraine posed an unacceptable threat to Russia.
The problem is this has never had any bit of truth to it
NATO was/is perceived as a threat to Russia by virtually every politician in Moscow's Federal Assembly. That's not a Putin thing. Before Putin, Yeltsin held the same belief.
Putin established NATO as a Russian adversary in 2000 when he asked NATO to incorporate Russia. NATO refused.
NATO is a military alliance. That's worth repeating. NATO is a military alliance. It was formed to oppose Russia and its Warsaw Pact. With no WP in the mix, and yet NATO not allowing Russian membership, Russians are not unreasonable to perceive NATO as a threat.
In WWII, Russia suffered nearly 70 times the casualties the US did --- 27M vs 400K. They'd have lost their country entirely if Germany had been able to launch its attack from Eastern Ukraine instead of Western Poland. Like it or not, Russians do not want a major adversary on their border.
Thanks NC. You guys just dont understand. It doesnt matter what you "think", its what the Russians believe. NATO was invented as an adversary to Russia and Russia alone. And when you keep creeping closer to their border, after being warned again and again. At some point they have no option.
And we obviously have not learned and he is once again warning us to back off, to no avail. Not for Ukraine's benefit, but ours. If we had stayed out of this 1000s of lives would have been saved and this would be over.
Posted on 9/25/22 at 7:23 am to BayouBlitz
quote:no, just vastly smarter
Are you drunk?
way tf above you
Posted on 9/25/22 at 7:31 am to trinidadtiger
quote:precisely, Trinidad.
Thanks NC. You guys just dont understand. It doesnt matter what you "think", its what the Russians believe. NATO was invented as an adversary to Russia and Russia alone. And when you keep creeping closer to their border, after being warned again and again. At some point they have no option.
And we obviously have not learned and he is once again warning us to back off, to no avail. Not for Ukraine's benefit, but ours. If we had stayed out of this 1000s of lives would have been saved and this would be over.
For some reason this most basic first principle escapes people.
As plain as the nose on their faces and THE dominant principle of 10,000 years of geopolitics, and they are unable to even entertain grasping such truth...
As plain as the Cuban missile crisis, the communist Kurds on the Turkish border...
and every case of behavior similar to the communist adoring Obama/Nuland and their coup
The USA is responsible for what Russia is saying. and responsible for whatever number of deaths already and deaths to come.
This post was edited on 9/25/22 at 10:45 am
Posted on 9/25/22 at 7:31 am to trinidadtiger
quote:explain to me how Ukraine being a puppet State of nato is bad but Ukraine being a puppet State of Russia is good. Seems to me we are in one of those situations where what's good for the goose is not good for the gander, Russia must be allowed to control all the border states for there security. So tell me why nato countries like Poland don't have the same security concerns over a Russian controlled Ukraine that Russia would have over a nato Ukraine. Especially since Russia has done multiple military land grabs in the region since 2014, and nobody has done anything like that to Russian territory
NATO was invented as an adversary to Russia and Russia alone. And when you keep creeping closer to their border, after being warned again and again. At some point they have no option.
Posted on 9/25/22 at 7:35 am to trinidadtiger
quote:
NATO is a military alliance. That's worth repeating. NATO is a military alliance. It was formed to oppose Russia and its Warsaw Pact. With no WP in the mix, and yet NATO not allowing Russian membership, Russians are not unreasonable to perceive NATO as a threat.
And this is the Crux of the matter. Once the Soviet Union and Warsaw Pact collapsed, NATO was no longer necessary, at least not in the same capacity. By continuing to add members, many former Warsaw Pact countries, the message was sent: Russia was still considered an enemy and she would slowly be strangled to death.
We caused this war.
Posted on 9/25/22 at 7:52 am to Indefatigable
quote:
Can’t manufacture a Ukrainian invasion of actual Russian territory in order to escalate the conflict?
That’s fine—just annex part of Ukraine into Russia and then cry foul.
Putin knows he won't have domestic support for an all-out war with the West unless they attack Russia first. Sometimes you have to literally pick up and move the goal posts to get the result you want.
Posted on 9/25/22 at 10:34 am to JJJimmyJimJames
Thanks JJJ.
By the way, nice thread, good points on both sides, its why I enjoy the board, thanks to all.
By the way, nice thread, good points on both sides, its why I enjoy the board, thanks to all.
Posted on 9/25/22 at 10:52 am to Perfect Circle
quote:Absolutely.
We caused this war.
and the stolen elections in Ukraine and in the United States were proof of how evil the evil empire was cementing its evil intent in its "fundamental transformation of the United States of Amuurka"
Anyone supporting leftists anywhere from this point on are supporters of pure evil.
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