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2
Posted on 2/7/12 at 3:50 pm to Sheep
quote:
Billy Donovan was 5-11 and 6-10 in the SEC in his first two years at Florida. He couldn't do it. Did Florida make the wrong decision in keeping him?
For every Donovan....I could name guys that did it quick. And I said 3 years....not 2
All I need to know is that the outgoing Senior class in 2009 had 64 wins (winningest in Baylor history).
Then they had a 20+ season and 18 the last 2 years........I'd say that's better than what LSU is doing.
Then you have THIS year....and what they are doing in recruiting.
Drew would be a good fit here.
Posted on 2/7/12 at 3:53 pm to The Cable Guy
quote:
f my memory serves correct, wasn't Baylor given the death penalty bc Carlton Dotson killed his teammate and Dave bliss covered it up? I'd say he needed a few years to catch up, wouldn't you?
It wasn't exactly the death penalty but they lost schollies and couldn't schedule non-conference games.
Posted on 2/7/12 at 3:54 pm to The Cable Guy
quote:
If my memory serves correct, wasn't Baylor given the death penalty bc Carlton Dotson killed his teammate and Dave bliss covered it up? I'd say he needed a few years to catch up, wouldn't you?
Sure, but even with the death penalty..... LSU and Baylor are similar programs over the last twenty years.
People turn and run from that fact because they believe LSU is the greatest..... but I'd bet you'd be hard pressed to find 10 worse major conference programs than LSU over the last 20 years. (DePaul? Rutgers? Maybe Northwestern?) And that's WITH our 12 or so NBA players in that time frame to prop up our record. Think about what that means.... with TWELVE NBA players, we've managed to average ONE conference win per season better than a team that got the death penalty.
I just don't get how people expect LSU to be "fixed" in no more than two years, when you can't get GOOD programs (Vandy or Florida or State) stable in that time frame.
It's NUTS.
This post was edited on 2/7/12 at 3:57 pm
Posted on 2/7/12 at 3:56 pm to Sheep
quote:
I just don't get how people expect LSU to be "fixed" in no more than two years, when you can't get GOOD programs (Vandy or Florida or State) stable in that time frame.
LSU should be a good program.....no excuses
LSU doesn't need to be "fixed"....it needs to be run better.
TJ is not the guy.
Posted on 2/7/12 at 3:57 pm to saintsfan22
They were not given the death penalty.
And Drew is a good coach. No one is saying otherwise. He was given time to build the program the way he wanted it built and it has paid off. It took a long time, but he did it.
Are we willing to accept that length of time? If not, fine. But don't compare the two situations.
And Drew is a good coach. No one is saying otherwise. He was given time to build the program the way he wanted it built and it has paid off. It took a long time, but he did it.
Are we willing to accept that length of time? If not, fine. But don't compare the two situations.
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:03 pm to Elleshoe
quote:
fwiw, and you know I'm not a huge Trent basher
Same here , not anti-TJ...but the level of talent we have right now and the overall fit w/ the program...Drew wouldn't be any worse. The biggest thing we have to look forward to right now is maybe a NIT bid....as far as being in the top 4 teams in the conference...tough to tell how far behind that group we are. (UK/Vandy/Fla/Mizzou)
This post was edited on 2/7/12 at 4:05 pm
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:03 pm to Sheep
quote:
but I'd bet you'd be hard pressed to find 10 worse major conference programs than LSU over the last 20 years. (DePaul? Rutgers? Maybe Northwestern?)
Auburn
Ole Miss
South Carolina
Northwestern(they've never been to a tourney, that you put maybe speaks volumes)
Penn St.
Oregon St.
Miami
Rutgers
Seton Hall
Arizona St.
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:04 pm to MSMHater
Baylor job is probably better than LSU at this point. Baylor is starting to get a nice little program in Waco. Football up and coming, both basketball teams are NCAA tourney worthy, baseball team is regional material.
They just might pass Texas A&M
They just might pass Texas A&M
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:13 pm to The Cable Guy
quote:Instant rejection
Instant upgrade, instant turnaround
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:15 pm to Gravitiger
First of all, I doubt Drew would consider it. He just completed a years-long, gut-wrenching rebuild job. I'm sure he wants to enjoy the fruits of his labor.
Secondly, I doubt Alleva, with his Duke pedigree, would consider someone with a slimy reputation, like Drew.
Secondly, I doubt Alleva, with his Duke pedigree, would consider someone with a slimy reputation, like Drew.
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:15 pm to Gravitiger
I don't know why but I literally laughed out loud
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:18 pm to lsusteve1
I'd pay him whatever he wants.
For all this talk about how dirty he is I have yet to see one specific allegation of NCAA violations committed while he's been there - and it isn't like Baylor has been off the radar since he's had that job.
For all this talk about how dirty he is I have yet to see one specific allegation of NCAA violations committed while he's been there - and it isn't like Baylor has been off the radar since he's had that job.
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:28 pm to Bubba Hotep
quote:
Secondly, I doubt Alleva, with his Duke pedigree, would consider someone with a slimy reputation, like Drew.
You assume Alleva would be around to make the next basketball coaching hire if Trent got the axe. I would suggest that is not a safe assumption by any means.
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:35 pm to saintsfan22
quote:
Auburn
Ole Miss
South Carolina
No. I checked. They've all won more conference games than LSU since '93. So has Georgia. LSU has the worst conference record since 1993.
(And, I'm using conference record/conference winning percentage as the barometer of good/bad. I'm open to other ideas, but if you look at that over any time frame, the best teams in any conference are at the top. The SEC's top 3 since 1993 are Kentucky, Florida and State. I don't think anyone would argue about that. I can't think of a more consistent barometer.)
quote:
Oregon St
Checked. Surprisingly, they're almost always a 6-7-8 win team. Never GOOD, never EMBARRASSING.
quote:
Miami
Nope. Miami, Florida State, Virginia Tech all surprisingly "average."
quote:
Seton Hall
Doubt it, but perhaps.
quote:
Penn St., Arizona St.
Good ideas. I'll check. Maybe Iowa State?
The MAJOR conference teams that I came up with that had worse conference records than LSU (117-175, .396) since 1993 were Rutgers, Northwestern, Baylor and DePaul. I'll keep looking if people give me ideas.
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:41 pm to Sheep
quote:I think that is a bit of an oversimplification. For example, I'd take 12-4 with a conference championship and a Sweet 16 followed by 4-12 with no postseason, over 9-7 with early round NIT exits two consecutive years. But without the other variables, the total record of 18-14 looks better than 16-16. I prefer higher highs and lower lows to consistent mediocrity. (But that doesn't mean that a program like LSU shouldn't aspire for something more than consistent mediocrity or inconsistent greatness).
And, I'm using conference record/conference winning percentage as the barometer of good/bad. I'm open to other ideas, but if you look at that over any time frame, the best teams in any conference are at the top...I can't think of a more consistent barometer.
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:41 pm to Sheep
On another note......UNACCEPTABLE
quote:
“I just felt like coach (Trent) Johnson didn’t put forth a great enough effort to get me,” Gathers said. “He kind of sent most of the assistant coaches on me like Brent Scott. I had to realize I wasn’t going to be playing for Brent Scott; I was going to be playing for coach Johnson. The simple fact I had only seen coach Johnson at one of my games, and that was the Scotlandville game this year. That doesn’t even really count because that was in Baton Rouge.”
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:46 pm to macaoidh
quote:No head coach these days (besides Tim Floyd) is dumb enough to implicate himself personally in a dirty recruiting scandal. But they all hire assistants with a big wink that they know will do whatever it takes.
For all this talk about how dirty he is I have yet to see one specific allegation of NCAA violations committed while he's been there - and it isn't like Baylor has been off the radar since he's had that job.
Here is a story of one of Drew's top assistants sending many illegal text messages to a foreign-born recruit, even threatening to have him deported if he didn't sign with Baylor (just FYI, he signed with Indiana amidst other allegations of impropriety in his recruitment). The NCAA is still investigating Baylor's involvement, to my knowledge.
LINK
This post was edited on 2/7/12 at 4:47 pm
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:48 pm to lsusteve1
That Gathers quote is very discouraging. It sounds like he was giving us a legit look.
Posted on 2/7/12 at 4:49 pm to Gravitiger
quote:
I think that is a bit of an oversimplification. For example, I'd take 12-4 with a conference championship and a Sweet 16 followed by 4-12 with no postseason, over 9-7 with early round NIT exits two consecutive years. But without the other variables, the total record of 18-14 looks better than 16-16. I prefer higher highs and lower lows to consistent mediocrity. (But that doesn't mean that a program like LSU shouldn't aspire for something more than consistent mediocrity or inconsistent greatness).
Yeah. It's tough to find a good barometer.
What can you use? Postseason appearances? Final Fours or Sweet 16s? That's tough, because what about VCU. Do we want to be VCU?
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