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re: That is why you start Ackenhausen
Posted on 6/3/24 at 9:39 pm to lostinbr
Posted on 6/3/24 at 9:39 pm to lostinbr
quote:
Saying we lost because he went to Jump (which is also silly IMO) =/= saying we lost because Ack didn’t start.
I’ve said both. I wanted him to start before the game, but somewhat understood wanting him in high leverage situations. However, I do have a problem with not starting him if you aren’t going to used him in high leverage situations. My whole point is limiting your best remaining pitcher to 3 outs is dumb.
I’m not saying pitching is what lost us the game. I think this game played out very similar to our entire season. Our pitching really wasn’t that bad this year. Our offense was extremely inconsistent all year long, just like it was this weekend. That’s why I think the pitching decisions were so important. Our offense has struggled to put together multiple offensive games all year long, you knew they would eventually struggle again. And you can save the SEC tournament talk. I’ve already gotten killed on here because I said facing the #8 guy in the SEC tournament is different than facing high leverage guys on the #4 team in the country.
I’m not saying that pitching is the only reason we lost. I think there were multiple things that led to this loss, this is just one.
This post was edited on 6/3/24 at 10:14 pm
2
Posted on 6/3/24 at 9:42 pm to vidtiger23
Uh, not Dutton.
Posted on 6/3/24 at 9:46 pm to LSBoosie
quote:
However, I do have a problem with not starting him if you aren’t going to used him in high leverage situations.
The 8th inning with a 1 run lead is high leverage you fricking waterhead.
quote:
My whole point is limiting your best remaining pitcher to 3 outs is dumb.
He couldn’t locate his fastball. In fact, he was missing badly with it. The only one he threw for a strike was a 3-2 middle in that could have been hit over the scoreboard.
Most coaches aren’t going to send a guy back out there to close out the game when he’s showing that he can’t throw anything but offspeed for strikes.
Posted on 6/3/24 at 9:56 pm to RB10
quote:
The 8th inning with a 1 run lead is high leverage you fricking waterhead.
No shite. And what do you consider the 9th inning with a 1 run lead?
quote:
He couldn’t locate his fastball. In fact, he was missing badly with it. The only one he threw for a strike was a 3-2 middle in that could have been hit over the scoreboard.
He got 3 fricking strikeouts. Pull him after he gives up a hit or walks somebody in the 9th.
quote:
Most coaches aren’t going to send a guy back out there to close out the game when he’s showing that he can’t throw anything but offspeed for strikes.
So they just sent out a guy who threw 105 pitches 3 days ago to throw 90% fastballs.
Posted on 6/3/24 at 10:19 pm to LSBoosie
quote:
I’ve said both. I wanted him to start before the game, but somewhat understood wanting him in high leverage situations. However, I do have a problem with not starting him if you aren’t going to used him in high leverage situations. My whole point is limiting your best remaining pitcher to 3 outs is dumb.
If Hellmers had been pulled in the 4th or 5th, we probably would have seen Ackenhausen pitch 4-5 innings even if he started to struggle a bit. Again, there was no way anyone knew we were going to get 5.2 shutout innings from Hellmers.
Once you get that performance from Hellmers, it becomes a bit of a moot point. It’s a sunk cost fallacy. Once you’re in the 9th inning and Jump is available the only thing that matters is who gives you the best chance to win right then and there.
If your argument (with the benefit of hindsight) then becomes that Ack would have been a better option than Jump, then.. OK I guess? I think that’s very debatable but nobody can know for sure. But it’s a completely separate discussion from the decision not to start him, because - again - there’s absolutely no way anyone can act like they knew Hellmers was going to pitch 5.2 shutout innings in the most important game of the season.
I would go further to say that I think Johnson has actually shown he is really good at planning out the pitching rotation between last year’s postseason, the SEC tournament this year, and this regional. Our game 5 staff just outperformed our season ERA against the #4 national seed, in their stadium.
Posted on 6/3/24 at 10:19 pm to LSBoosie
I agree but God damn we can't complain about the pitching tonight.
I also would have stuck with Ack in the 9th. At least until.he gave up a baserunner
That looked like good ack
I also would have stuck with Ack in the 9th. At least until.he gave up a baserunner
That looked like good ack
This post was edited on 6/3/24 at 10:21 pm
Posted on 6/3/24 at 10:34 pm to lostinbr
quote:
If your argument (with the benefit of hindsight) then becomes that Ack would have been a better option than Jump, then.. OK I guess?
Well first it’s not hindsight, I said as it was happening that I wish they would send Ack back out.
quote:
there’s absolutely no way anyone can act like they knew Hellmers was going to pitch 5.2 shutout innings in the most important game of the season.
Agreed, there’s no way of knowing who would get hot and be able to put up innings, but that is part of my point. IMO, in a game like this you throw your best options in order. Throw your best guy first and ride him as long as you can. When he gets in trouble, move on to option 2, and so forth. Also if the plan all along was for Jump to be put in for a high leverage situation, that even furthers my point of using Ack earlier.
Posted on 6/3/24 at 10:36 pm to Honkus
I’m not really say we pitched bad. We didn’t, we only gave up 4 runs. I’m more so speaking on the philosophy behind the pitching decisions that I didn’t understand.
Posted on 6/3/24 at 10:46 pm to LSBoosie
quote:
I’m not really say we pitched bad. We didn’t, we only gave up 4 runs. I’m more so speaking on the philosophy behind the pitching decisions that I didn’t understand.
I mean you’re saying it was Jay “overcoaching” and pointing to it as a reason we lost.
It’s a typical LSBoosie pot shot at a coach after a loss, but it’s an even sillier pot shot if you agree that the pitching was good tonight.
This post was edited on 6/3/24 at 10:54 pm
Posted on 6/3/24 at 10:48 pm to LSBoosie
Posted on 6/3/24 at 11:06 pm to lostinbr
quote:
I mean you’re saying it was Jay “overcoaching” and pointing to it as a reason we lost.
Because I think it is one of the reasons, and I think it’s ok to criticize the coach just like we can criticize Jake Brown for not catching a fly ball, or the entire team for not hitting.
I’ll never understand people who will say “why are you criticizing the coach” then turn around and blame an 18 year old without batting an eye. They can all get criticized.
Posted on 6/4/24 at 7:16 am to LSBoosie
quote:
I’ll never understand people who will say “why are you criticizing the coach” then turn around and blame an 18 year old without batting an eye. They can all get criticized.
And I’ll never understand people who feel like they need to constantly take pot shots at the coach, at every single opportunity.
It’s not that people can’t be critical of a coach. It’s that you are so ridiculously critical of every decision/statement that you might as well be a Pirate Queen alter.
This thread is a perfect example. Again, our pitching staff outperformed any reasonable expectations (based on the season up to that point) yesterday. You acknowledge that the lack of offense was a glaring issue. But all you want to focus on is pitching decisions. Why? Because it’s the easiest thing to blame on Jay Johnson.
You can argue otherwise (I fully expect that you will), but there’s very little reason to give you the benefit of the doubt because you do this all the time. You’re chicken little. Only, instead of saying “the sky is falling,” you say “[insert decision/statement/etc.] was dumb” and then have the audacity to act like you don’t understand why people are reacting negatively.
Posted on 6/4/24 at 7:21 am to skullhawk
quote:
5 freaking hits, man No need to talk about pitching
We crushed the ball all game long.
It became a pitcher dual, and we fricked up the rotation at the end of the game.
Posted on 6/4/24 at 7:22 am to LSBoosie
LSU got burned when they had to use Herring for the extended outing against Wofford
It would have been nice to have him available for the last game in some capacity
It would have been nice to have him available for the last game in some capacity
Posted on 6/4/24 at 8:15 am to lostinbr
quote:
And I’ll never understand people who feel like they need to constantly take pot shots at the coach, at every single opportunity.
I’ve praised them too. I’ve said Jay is a great coach. He won us a natty. He’s great, but he’s not perfect. You being so upset that a pubic figure head coach is criticized after losing a win or go home game is crazy.
quote:
It’s not that people can’t be critical of a coach. It’s that you are so ridiculously critical of every decision/statement that you might as well be a Pirate Queen alter.
Lol Jay has made tens of thousands of decisions/statements this year and I’ve been critical of what like 10 of them? How dare I?
quote:
You acknowledge that the lack of offense was a glaring issue. But all you want to focus on is pitching decisions.
You just said that I acknowledged them. I have focused on the offensive issues several times all year, you just choose to ignore that. I focused on the pitching decisions here because I had conversations with people on this board about these exact decisions before and as they were happening.
If you can’t take anyone saying anything negative about coaches/players I’m not sure a sports message board is the best place for you to be.
Posted on 6/4/24 at 8:16 am to LSBoosie
quote:
Either way they limited their best available bullpen arm to 3 outs and that makes no sense to me.
Totally agree. In that situation you send Ack back out to start the 9th. Put a one batter leash on him if you want, but you don’t know how many innings you might need in a close game like that. If Ack even lightly struggles then bring Jump in to be the savior. Too heavy a coaching hand there.
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