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re: How far can a Ingram led team take us?
Posted on 6/12/23 at 8:12 pm to Soggymoss
Posted on 6/12/23 at 8:12 pm to Soggymoss
quote:
His record is 106-117 over 4 years, 60-70 without Zion.
So 10 games under .500 without a playoff caliber power forward on the roster.
quote:
Yes because you cannot turn the team over to the actual #1 guy without feelings getting hurt. Case in point look at Boston
Brown wasn’t touted as the guy either. Brown and Ingram aren’t the same people. Ingram is a far more skilled player than Brown.
quote:
Pels are 57-57 when Zion plays. Zion has played 21 games without Ingram and has a winning record in those games.
so in essence, Trey Murphy worked out, but Jaxson Hayes didn’t. Got it.
Furthermore, Point Zion is ultimately a mistake unless he can shoot. Which he can’t.
This post was edited on 6/12/23 at 8:46 pm
2
Posted on 6/12/23 at 8:47 pm to ThanosIsADemocrat
You make some good points but honestly not sure if Ingram is better than Jaylen Brown. Many would argue Brown is better or at least the same in regards to impacting a game. I honestly believe Zion is the better player than BI but dude never plays so its hard to really say.
Posted on 6/12/23 at 8:59 pm to Pels_Yaz
I know we are debating Brown and Ingram right now, but there is also an argument to be made that Ingram is at the very least, offensively better than Tatum.
Ingram is clearly more skilled overall offensively. Tatum isn’t even necessarily a better 3 point shooter than Ingram, he just takes 6 more a game.
Last year, I would’ve said, Tatum is a better defender than Ingram. Tatum regressed horribly on defense this season though (especially in the playoffs).
Ingram is clearly more skilled overall offensively. Tatum isn’t even necessarily a better 3 point shooter than Ingram, he just takes 6 more a game.
Last year, I would’ve said, Tatum is a better defender than Ingram. Tatum regressed horribly on defense this season though (especially in the playoffs).
Posted on 6/12/23 at 9:03 pm to 3PieceSpicy
I’m sorry you lost me on that one. Tatum is a much better player than Ingram. I don’t even think its close. Tatum was a MVP candidate player this season and has made multiple all star games. He also is a much better consistent scorer and being the number one guy on his team the past 2 years he has led his team to the nba finals and one game from the finals this year. I don’t even think its remotely close.
Posted on 6/12/23 at 9:16 pm to 3PieceSpicy
quote:
Ingram is clearly more skilled overall offensively. Tatum isn’t even necessarily a better 3 point shooter than Ingram, he just takes 6 more a game.
Last year, I would’ve said, Tatum is a better defender than Ingram. Tatum regressed horribly on defense this season though (especially in the playoffs).
This is a really really bad take
Posted on 6/12/23 at 9:51 pm to Baron
A BI-led team can lead us to multiple championships.
This post was edited on 6/12/23 at 9:52 pm
Posted on 6/12/23 at 10:11 pm to ThanosIsADemocrat
quote:If you need a playoff caliber PF to be a #1 and better than 10 games under .500, then you're not a #1.
So 10 games under .500 without a playoff caliber power forward on the roster.
quote:
This post was edited on 6/12/23 at 11:48 pm
Posted on 6/12/23 at 11:37 pm to Baron
quote:
Still, how far do you think a team whose second best player is Joe Johnson can go?
Ask the 7 seconds or Less Suns.
quote:
I should clarify. This has more to do with people wanting to keep BI but move on from Zion.
If the return is Sharpe and Scoot, can we trade the injured big who spent some of last season in Portland? They love their injured bigs up there.
The other guy is prepping for Team USA and going to the Finals with the coach and best defender in between two a days at the facility.
This is insanity to think that Ingram is the one that should go.
Although neither should go at the moment.
Posted on 6/12/23 at 11:40 pm to shel311
quote:
If you need a playoff caliber PF to be a #1 and better than 19 games under .500, then you're not a #1.
How about above league average? Which neither an injured Nance, Willy nor Hayes is.
This post was edited on 6/12/23 at 11:41 pm
Posted on 6/12/23 at 11:53 pm to ThanosIsADemocrat
quote:If you have a supporting cast of CJ/Trey/Jval/Herb and you still need another above average player to sniff .500 over a representative sample size, you're probably not fit to be #1.
How about above league average? Which neither an injured Nance, Willy nor Hayes is.
Posted on 6/13/23 at 12:10 am to Baron
Not really. I watched every single playoff game of the Celtics this year as well as a ton of their regular season games.
Ingram is simply a more complete offensive player than Tatum. Tatum just chucks a lot of threes and very occasionally gets hot. Tatum is either rim or 3 ball and he’s not particularly great at either. Ingram can actually get you a tough guarded bucket. Tatum just panics and heat checks step back threes.
And his defense regressed horribly during the playoffs.
Ingram is simply a more complete offensive player than Tatum. Tatum just chucks a lot of threes and very occasionally gets hot. Tatum is either rim or 3 ball and he’s not particularly great at either. Ingram can actually get you a tough guarded bucket. Tatum just panics and heat checks step back threes.
And his defense regressed horribly during the playoffs.
Posted on 6/13/23 at 12:15 am to shel311
quote:
If you have a supporting cast of CJ/Trey/Jval/Herb and you still need another above average player to sniff .500 over a representative sample size, you're probably not fit to be #1.
So…just a gaping whole at the 4 has more Impact on a players status as a “#1” than wins and losses in basketball. Okay, then.
What if that cast has an above average power forward like Gordon or Randle?
This post was edited on 6/13/23 at 12:18 am
Posted on 6/13/23 at 12:20 am to Baron
1st round exit.
Eventually 2nd round but I don't think really.
Eventually 2nd round but I don't think really.
Posted on 6/13/23 at 12:56 am to Soggymoss
quote:
There’s only one guy on this team capable of doing that, and it’s not Ingram.
Zion has NBA finals potential as the best player but..Injury prone asf
Posted on 6/13/23 at 5:39 am to nicj4
quote:
Zion has NBA finals potential as the best player but..Injury prone asf
He’s shown he can stay healthy, he did it year 2. That’s why we’re revamping the medical/training staff, it’s not for BI, it’s for Zion.
Get Zion right and Pels will be there within the next 3-5 years.
Posted on 6/13/23 at 5:44 am to Jester
quote:
A BI-led team can lead us to multiple championships.
A BI led team has gotten us to:
Missed playoffs
10th seed to play-in game win and out in 1st round
Knocked out in play-in game
A BI led team AT BEST gets to the second round and gets knocked out, thats the ceiling.
Posted on 6/13/23 at 9:24 am to Soggymoss
I just don't see the person trading zion or bi this year.
Next year is another story.
Next year is another story.
Posted on 6/13/23 at 9:45 am to 3PieceSpicy
quote:So Tatum takes more efficient shots than Ingram.
Ingram is simply a more complete offensive player than Tatum. Tatum just chucks a lot of threes and very occasionally gets hot. Tatum is either rim or 3 ball
quote:What? Tatum's TS% was .607 this season, that is elite for a volume scorer, how does he have elite efficiency if all he does is shoot 3s or at the rim and isn't particularly great at either?
and he’s not particularly great at either. Ingram can actually get you a tough guarded bucket.
BI has never came close to a .600 TS%.
Posted on 6/13/23 at 9:47 am to shel311
We shouldn’t even argue this. Tatum is by far a better player than Ingram. If Ingram was better than Tatum theres no way his name comes up in Scoot trade talks.
Posted on 6/13/23 at 9:49 am to ThanosIsADemocrat
quote:Name all the guys who you think are true #1s who have 4 above average players on their teams and are 10 games under .500 over a representative sample size.
So…just a gaping whole at the 4 has more Impact on a players status as a “#1” than wins and losses in basketball. Okay, then.
1. BI
2. ???
Again, if you have that many above average players on your team and you still need 1 more to just get to .500, then you're showing me a guy who isn't a true #1 option.
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