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Message
1
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:27 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
Most kids attend college and don't rack up that kind of debt.
If you rack up that kind of debt, you probably shouldn't have gone to college. Yet these people do because they're told their entire life that that's the only way.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:28 pm to TH03
quote:
I don't know why people here are so quick to blame the students instead of the system. We learned all growing up that after high school, you go to college, and then get a job. It's so engrained into society that for most, there is no other choice.
I think you're blaming the wrong system. The system that needs blaming is government backed student loans that have allowed universities to expand absurd curriculums and increase cost per student exponentially. If college were to be made "free", these costs would skyrocket 100x faster than they are now.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:28 pm to gthog61
Well people can't call other people dumb if they can't use simple grammar correctly.
No need to melt about it.
No need to melt about it.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:29 pm to upgrayedd
quote:
The system that needs blaming is government backed student loans that have allowed universities to expand absurd curriculums and increase cost per student exponentially.
This goes hand in hand with what I'm talking about though.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:29 pm to TH03
quote:
If you rack up that kind of debt, you probably shouldn't have gone to college. Yet these people do because they're told their entire life that that's the only way.
Maybe, but they're also not told what majors are worthless because the schools have a vested interest in expanding all their programs.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:30 pm to TH03
quote:
The entire high school process is geared toward getting into college
Yea...but it's still on the individual for doing dumb shite when getting to college. I think it's safe to say most had career days or spent time researching what various careers pay while in school. And every student should know what tuition is before enrolling, and what it will mean for their financial future.
Being pushed toward college may be the systems fault... paying $90,000 for an arts degree and being downtrodden because she has to drive a $500 saturn is her fault.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:31 pm to FLObserver
1). Tell people they need a college degree to compete in the global 21st Century economy.
2). Look the other way when college don't follow free market based principles.
3) Make snide comments because you were fortunate to have parents who could pay for college back in the 90's. Yet fail to realize you won't be able to pay for your kid's college if this keeps up.
Check
2). Look the other way when college don't follow free market based principles.
3) Make snide comments because you were fortunate to have parents who could pay for college back in the 90's. Yet fail to realize you won't be able to pay for your kid's college if this keeps up.
Check
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:34 pm to BrohemAlem11
quote:
Yea...but it's still on the individual for doing dumb shite when getting to college. I think it's safe to say most had career days or spent time researching what various careers pay while in school. And every student should know what tuition is before enrolling, and what it will mean for their financial future.
This tells me you're under the assumption that everyone who goes to college is smart.
In fact, I'm saying the complete opposite. And to upgrayyed's point, these dumb people are finding validation in their idiocy by finding these absurd degrees offered by glorified degree mills.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:35 pm to FLObserver
Congrats to her for majoring in a hobby.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:37 pm to TH03
ok...we're more in agreement than I thought
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:37 pm to TH03
quote:
I don't know why people here are so quick to blame the students instead of the system. We learned all growing up that after high school, you go to college, and then get a job. It's so engrained into society that for most, there is no other choice.
Yep, no other choice at all.
I joined the Army at 17. Retired at 38. I’ve been working for my new company for almost 5 years. Have no college degree. Have no loan debt and make almost $90K a year. I know it’s not the OT standard of $10M+ a year. But I feel I’m doing pretty good.
The point is there are other options. Yeah, go to college if you want. But don’t bitch because you have $100K in loans, no job and a Guide to Romantic Comedies BS degree.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:48 pm to carhartt
quote:
Yep, no other choice at all.
He's not saying that there's no other choice. Between the military and trade schools, there are very viable options. However, I know that when I was in school it was pounded into my brain that if I don't go to college, then I'll be digging ditches the rest of my life.
We have to step away from pushing every kid to go the college. But that's not going to benefit the colleges' bottom lines, so we'll see how that goes.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:53 pm to Al R Bammer
This is where we are with things, in my opion -- people are less interested in trade jobs and skilled labor jobs because for decades it has been pounded into young people's brains that the measure of success is a college degree.
So many people began entering college that entry level positions began making "college degree" a minimum requirement to apply for a position. So more kids turn to college.
Kids also heard lots and lots of messages like "do what you love and you'll never work a day in your life" or "find your passion --- and then find a way to get paid for it" So now we have more and more people entering colleges and they also want to do things that are fun and rewarding or artistic -- so colleges begin offering more and more classes and diverse degrees (despite their being little to no job market for those degrees).
As a result of the demand for colleges and diverse degrees, colleges have increased tuition costs to astronomical levels. Also, things like TOPS and other subsidized tuition programs have further added to the college glut.
There are so many people with college degrees that many aren't finding entry level positions in remotely relevant fields to their degrees. So the students further the education (and debt) in an effort to separate themselves from the horde. Now they have masters and phds in fields that have no jobs and they have tens, sometimes hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt.
So.... people who would normally take trade jobs or skilled labor jobs are going to college to get degrees that don't have associated professions and they are paying $100k to be unemployed or in a low-level job with crippling debt.
Meanwhile, the trade and skilled labor jobs still pay great money (some better than ever due to shortages of people) and there is tepid interest in that type of work because parents and administrators taught kids that skilled labor was undesirable work.
I attended college from 94-98' and I had to do it all on student loans. The amount I paid over the life of those loans is but a fraction of what kids are paying now. It's disturbing.
I consider myself lucky that I graduated when I did because I see the challenges ahead for folks in college and for those (like my son) who are 10 years away from that decision.
I will say though, that I always considered what my "earning potential" would be before I signed my name to a single student loan. I hope I would have never paid $90k or above for a degree in a field that would never exceed $40-50k annually. That math would have never made sense to me.
So many people began entering college that entry level positions began making "college degree" a minimum requirement to apply for a position. So more kids turn to college.
Kids also heard lots and lots of messages like "do what you love and you'll never work a day in your life" or "find your passion --- and then find a way to get paid for it" So now we have more and more people entering colleges and they also want to do things that are fun and rewarding or artistic -- so colleges begin offering more and more classes and diverse degrees (despite their being little to no job market for those degrees).
As a result of the demand for colleges and diverse degrees, colleges have increased tuition costs to astronomical levels. Also, things like TOPS and other subsidized tuition programs have further added to the college glut.
There are so many people with college degrees that many aren't finding entry level positions in remotely relevant fields to their degrees. So the students further the education (and debt) in an effort to separate themselves from the horde. Now they have masters and phds in fields that have no jobs and they have tens, sometimes hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt.
So.... people who would normally take trade jobs or skilled labor jobs are going to college to get degrees that don't have associated professions and they are paying $100k to be unemployed or in a low-level job with crippling debt.
Meanwhile, the trade and skilled labor jobs still pay great money (some better than ever due to shortages of people) and there is tepid interest in that type of work because parents and administrators taught kids that skilled labor was undesirable work.
I attended college from 94-98' and I had to do it all on student loans. The amount I paid over the life of those loans is but a fraction of what kids are paying now. It's disturbing.
I consider myself lucky that I graduated when I did because I see the challenges ahead for folks in college and for those (like my son) who are 10 years away from that decision.
I will say though, that I always considered what my "earning potential" would be before I signed my name to a single student loan. I hope I would have never paid $90k or above for a degree in a field that would never exceed $40-50k annually. That math would have never made sense to me.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:58 pm to FLObserver
quote:
"This is really a pervasive trend and it will not be reversed any time soon," said Richard Curtin, director of the University of Michigan Survey of Consumers.
There's a dick/curtain joke in there, somewhere....
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:58 pm to carhartt
Congrats?
That in no way disproves my point. The military was given as an option for people who couldn't get into college or had issues that needed to be straightened out. I even grew up next to an air Force Base, and no one growing up gave that to us as an option. It's a great option that more people should be directed towards.
I already said these people were stupid and probably shouldn't have gone to college. I'm only getting at why they thought they had to. And to upgrayyed's point, there's an entire industry that makes a lot of money off them too.
It's a lot easier for people like you to just make up stupid degrees to make fun of though.
That in no way disproves my point. The military was given as an option for people who couldn't get into college or had issues that needed to be straightened out. I even grew up next to an air Force Base, and no one growing up gave that to us as an option. It's a great option that more people should be directed towards.
quote:
Yeah, go to college if you want. But don’t bitch because you have $100K in loans, no job and a Guide to Romantic Comedies BS degree.
I already said these people were stupid and probably shouldn't have gone to college. I'm only getting at why they thought they had to. And to upgrayyed's point, there's an entire industry that makes a lot of money off them too.
It's a lot easier for people like you to just make up stupid degrees to make fun of though.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 12:59 pm to FLObserver
Only on the OT does someone make fun of someone for doing the right thing. Yeah she got a worthless degree, I’m sure she regrets that. What would you rather her do, not pay it off and have more baby boomers bitch anyway? Damned if you do, damned if you don’t.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 1:00 pm to cleeveclever
quote:
cleeveclever
Great post.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 1:04 pm to TH03
quote:
What an idiot for following parental and societal pressure and attending college!
It will be interesting to see if this trend reverses in the future. Me and my wife (both millenials) were pressured to go to college and were taught to look down on those who didn't. We have both agreed to not do the same with our son and instead guide him to a good career, whether that be one that requires a degree or not.
Posted on 3/14/19 at 1:04 pm to TH03
Some blame should be put on parents for not educating their kids on the right path in college. They could steer their kids towards a more useful degree.
And laugh all you want, but Romantic Comedies is a real PhD program.
And laugh all you want, but Romantic Comedies is a real PhD program.
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