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Started By
Message
re: Alien Enemies Act does apply to Tren de Aragua
Posted on 3/28/25 at 11:50 am to SlowFlowPro
Posted on 3/28/25 at 11:50 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:"please stop pointing out the obvious bullshite from the hack Reason magazine article that I've posted 10000 times. Eric Boehm is so dreeaamy"
Stay on topic
1
Posted on 3/28/25 at 11:51 am to Vacherie Saint
Are determining if the act applies to those people is very important
Otherwise an administration can invoke the act and just pick up anybody and deport them to a third world country, without any oversight. That includes citizens
Otherwise an administration can invoke the act and just pick up anybody and deport them to a third world country, without any oversight. That includes citizens
Posted on 3/28/25 at 11:52 am to UncleFestersLegs
quote:
the obvious bullshite
Does not exist
And, regardless, normal immigration law has no part of this discussion.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 11:55 am to TrueTiger
Yup. The Venezuela government has used them to do dirty deeds in Venezuela as well as other South American countries.
Trump isn't just shooting from the hip...... he knows and has a plan.
The Dems and globalist can't get in front of him.
Thats why all the globalist/Marxist, here in the US and internationally, are screaming like lil butt hurt bitches!
Trump isn't just shooting from the hip...... he knows and has a plan.
The Dems and globalist can't get in front of him.
Thats why all the globalist/Marxist, here in the US and internationally, are screaming like lil butt hurt bitches!
Posted on 3/28/25 at 11:57 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Are determining if the act applies to those people is very important
Otherwise an administration can invoke the act and just pick up anybody and deport them to a third world country, without any oversight. That includes citizens
No, the law wasn't made for citizens, thats you trying attempting to once again confuse the issue. The law was created for exactly what Trump used it for.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:02 pm to lake chuck fan
quote:
No, the law wasn't made for citizens,
So say they pick up lake chuck fan.
If the argument is the admin's proclamation is exclusive, final, and un-reviewable, then lake chuck fan is going to El Salvador
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:04 pm to EliasGrodin
quote:
Alien Enemies Act does apply to Tren de Aragua
For purposes of discussion, let's assume that this is true.
Can a US president just unilaterally grab any foreigner on US soil, claim that this person is a member of Tren de Aragua and deport that person?
From the Alien Enemies Act
quote:
The President is authorized in any such event, by his proclamation thereof, or other public act, to direct the conduct to be observed on the part of the United States, toward the aliens who become so liable
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:11 pm to wdhalgren
he only has authority over the “natives, citizens, denizens, or subjects of the hostile nation or government”
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:11 pm to TrueTiger
Of course it does. This is just a Dem/Leftist strategy to make all good things difficult.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:13 pm to SammyTiger
quote:
he only has authority over the “natives, citizens, denizens, or subjects of the hostile nation or government”
Nobody has suggested that the Alien Enemies act applies to US citizens. The hostile nation(s) or government(s) are those nations or governments designated by the president.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:19 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
This is why Due Process is important. If the amin can show this, do it in open court with evidence.
Takes too long. Just like a lawyer to drag shite out.
Deport every single illegal.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:24 pm to wdhalgren
quote:
Nobody has suggested that the Alien Enemies act applies to US citizens. The hostile nation(s) or government(s) are those nations or governments designated by the president.
You apparently do not understand the danger of the Administration’s position. The Trump Administration is taking the position that any and all actions that it justifies by citing the Alien Enemies Act cannot be reviewed by courts or anyone else. Your assumption is that if the feds pick up a citizen for deportation to El Salvador’s super-max prison, the citizens will have an opportunity to object and show that the feds made a mistake and that you cannot be deported and sent to prison in El Salvador. However, if the Administrations position is adopted, there is no process for objection. You get deported and no one can do anything about it.
There are other obvious issues. Suppose that the feds pick up someone who legally immigrated here from Ecuador, and has never committed a crime. There is not even a suggestion that Ecuador is invading or at war with the US. The feds say (incorrectly) that the person is Venezuelan and that they are being sent to prison in El Salvador. Under the Administration’s position, there is no way for anyone to object to the obvious injustice. No due process.
Teh position that the Administration is taking is untenable..
This post was edited on 3/28/25 at 12:26 pm
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:29 pm to SlowFlowPro
Admit it. You and Hank and Rextatur all got chubbies realizing JoeTatato had already seeded the US with these trained terrorists.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:30 pm to TBoy
Sorry and you too low TBoi
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:38 pm to Icansee4miles
quote:
Admit it. You and Hank and Rextatur all got chubbies realizing JoeTatato had already seeded the US with these trained terrorists.
Uh..negative.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:43 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
If the argument is the admin's proclamation is exclusive, final, and un-reviewable, then lake chuck fan is going to El Salvador
As stated, you are purposefully trying to convoluted the discussions with a bunch of fear-mongering.
AEA applies to Aliens, which specifically means non-citizens. It is also specifically specified in the law. To imply that this law could be or has been applied to citizens or illegal aliens thst were not designated as forgian terrorist is intellectually dishonest. There have been plenty of deportations that do not result in El Salvador prison.
With that said, I do think there are fair questions raised about the law and its application. The issue is while it isn’t inexplicably illegal for a US citizen to be a member of a gang, TdA was named a foreign terrorist organization and those members were on US soil. Therefore it is illegal for them to not only be in this country, like other illegal aliens, but they are also here as a terrorist. The law and application of the law applies differently for them and is why they have been relocated to El Salvador prison.
How law enforcement determined/vetted who is/isn’t in TdA was not the issue for the AEA or its application. That is a separate issue.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:51 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
This is why Due Process is important. If the amin can show this, do it in open court with evidence.
Why do we have an Aliens Enemy Act if we are going to ask that the Admin just go through the normal protocol for deportation?
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:56 pm to SlowFlowPro
this isnt hard. we can quibble about the legality of the invocation of the act, ie, whether the standards for invocation have been met (the revelation in the OP is certainly a blow to this judge). but we cannot question the authority of the president once said act is legally invoked.
Reason.com slap dick op-ed is arguing that they cant be deported without subjectively sufficient evidence that they are members and/or have committed violent crimes. This is incorrect. The judge is ruling on the legality of the act itself and has no jurisdiction over the manner at which the act is subsequently enforced. no liberal will ever accept the evidence given, regardless of merit. this is clear.
Reason.com slap dick op-ed is arguing that they cant be deported without subjectively sufficient evidence that they are members and/or have committed violent crimes. This is incorrect. The judge is ruling on the legality of the act itself and has no jurisdiction over the manner at which the act is subsequently enforced. no liberal will ever accept the evidence given, regardless of merit. this is clear.
Posted on 3/28/25 at 12:56 pm to LSUROXS
Arson?
LA fires????
LA fires????
Posted on 3/28/25 at 1:21 pm to TBoy
quote:
You apparently do not understand the danger of the Administration’s position.
I understand the danger, and so did the Legislature that wrote the act. They also understood the danger an invasion or predatory incursion posed to public safety and to the United States of America. Knowing those things, they wrote the law so as to give the President immediate authority over these decisions. The two pieces below are a very clearcut statement of the broad powers granted to the President by this act.
Invocation
quote:
Whenever there is a declared war between the United States and any foreign nation or government, or any invasion or predatory incursion is perpetrated, attempted, or threatened against the territory of the United States by any foreign nation or government, and the President makes public proclamation of the event, all natives, citizens, denizens, or subjects of the hostile nation or government, being of the age of fourteen years and upward, who shall be within the United States and not actually naturalized, shall be liable to be apprehended, restrained, secured, and removed as alien enemies.
Enforcement
quote:
The President is authorized in any such event, by his proclamation thereof, or other public act, to direct the conduct to be observed on the part of the United States, toward the aliens who become so liable; the manner and degree of the restraint to which they shall be subject and in what cases, and upon what security their residence shall be permitted, and to provide for the removal of those who, not being permitted to reside within the United States, refuse or neglect to depart therefrom; and to establish any other regulations which are found necessary in the premises and for the public safety.
I do believe the USSC has jurisdiction to review the invocation of the act, but they have in the past been hesitant to rule against the president's decision making power with regard to the EAA. I'm far less confident that an inferior court can or should usurp or even temporarily thwart either invocation or enforcement of the act as written, because that passes protection of the public safety and potentially the entire country to an unelected judge or judges who do not represent and serve the entire country with the imprimatur of constitutional authority.
As for your hypothetical, same answer. Benefit of the doubt goes to the public safety and the country. Due process as you describe essentially invalidates the entire act because then you end up with "individualized" review (as described by Boasberg) which could take years. This is an infringement of the greatest power given to the President by the Constitution, and in this act by the legislature; the power to defend the country and its citizens at a moment's notice.
This post was edited on 3/28/25 at 4:39 pm
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