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Posted on 12/30/23 at 5:28 pm to Revelator
quote:
Maybe I’m the only one, but,” humility” isn’t exactly the vibe I’m picking up from our Catholic posters
No; you’re absolutely right. And I get it- we’re all very passionate about what we believe, and why we believe it. Though it may not always seem like it- I can see how both sides are acting out of love- initially. Let’s just try to keep it civil. As I have said before- this is a sibling rivalry. It’s not a bad idea for us all to remember the things that we agree on- and be charitable in what we disagree on. We are in fact brothers and sisters.
Posted on 12/30/23 at 5:29 pm to Revelator
quote:
so far, no Catholic can tell me how many official dogmas you have.
So if y’all can’t tell me, how do you expect me to know?
I’ve asked you how many your faith has, and you haven’t answered.
Posted on 12/30/23 at 5:31 pm to Prodigal Son
quote:
As I have said before- this is a sibling rivalry. It’s not a bad idea for us all to remember the things that we agree on- and be charitable in what we disagree on. We are in fact brothers and sisters.
Amen. I hold no ill will with any conversation I have on religion with folks here!
This post was edited on 12/30/23 at 5:32 pm
Posted on 1/1/24 at 12:20 pm to Guntoter1
quote:I haven't moved the goal post at all. I've described precisely what I mean by "faith in Jesus Christ". You are the one--like the Mormons when talking to Chrstians--that is being vague about what you believe about Jesus Christ.quote:
It isn’t just “faith in Jesus Christ”, but the specific content of that faith. M
Ah, now we are getting somewhere.
So when I agree with your definition of salvation. “Faith in Jesus Christ as my savior”
You move the goal post and add to those requirements because I am Catholic..
So your sins are covered by Christ but not mine.
I understand
As James said, even the demons believe in God and shudder, and yet they do not believe that Christ paid the price for their sin. There is a difference between believing that Jesus existed as a man and believing that He is the God-man, who takes away the sins of His people. It's why the Creeds say what they say about Jesus, because it isn't sufficient to believe "in Jesus" if the content of that faith is utterly heretical. Believing as the Gnostics did that Jesus didn't come in the flesh removes the humanity of Jesus, which is necessary for Him to be our representative. Believing as the Muslims do that Jesus only came in the flesh and isn't the eternal son of God isn't sufficient because He needs to be God to satisfy God's wrath against sin.
Specifying what "faith in Jesus" means is not moving the goal post. If you do not believe that Jesus' death on the cross fully and finally satisfied God's wrath against our sin by the imputation of Christ's righteousness to us and our sinfulness to Christ, then you believe Christ did not satisfy God's justice, and we are still in our sin. That's important for salvation.
Posted on 1/1/24 at 12:30 pm to Champagne
quote:Luther made an interpretative choice based off of the meaning of the text. It happens all the time in translation. I don't usually like it, but sometimes it is necessary due to the lack of 1-to-1 equivalency between languages. In Luther's case, he wasn't wrong in his interpretation, especially considering it is the logical conclusion of what Paul was teaching in Romans 3:28. Adding "alone" may not be a literal word-for-word of the Greek, but it communicates the meaning of the verse accurately in German.
Luther added the word "alone" to that Bible passage when he translated it into the German language. His reasoning was, he said, because it made the translation more clear. Nevermind about changing the meaning of the passage. No. He didn't see it that way.
Martin Luther re-wrote the Bible into his own image.
I don't see what Luther did as adding to the Bible any more than when a translator adds the word "the" in English when the Greek article is missing from the text, however I do agree that it shouldn't be added to the text in English because it is unnecessary. The Scriptures teach "faith alone" clearly, and the word "alone" is wholly unnecessary to be added to the text when the logical construction of the grammar leads to the same conclusion.
This post was edited on 1/1/24 at 1:50 pm
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