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Message
re: Pope Francis infection is presenting a "complex, clinical picture" according to Vatican
Posted on 2/21/25 at 7:35 am to Squirrelmeister
Posted on 2/21/25 at 7:35 am to Squirrelmeister
Because this has been bumped.
Pope Francis health is improving but there are talks of resignation of the pope by some.
LINK
Pope Francis health is improving but there are talks of resignation of the pope by some.
LINK
3
Posted on 2/21/25 at 8:11 am to RollTide1987
He gone.......
Posted on 2/21/25 at 10:20 am to catholictigerfan
The pope should be casting out his demons and praying instead of relying on the quackery known as modern medicine and the scientific method.
Posted on 2/21/25 at 10:27 am to catholictigerfan
“resignation of the pope”
This will never happen for Francis.
This will never happen for Francis.
Posted on 2/21/25 at 7:26 pm to Squirrelmeister
quote:
Hey PS,
Hey fren
quote:
I think you agree with my statement, and I hope Champagne acknowledges as I have come to find out that there is no amount of evidence, facts, logic, or reason that will convince the other side.
I do agree. All I’ve ever really wanted you to understand and admit to- is that it goes both ways. As we have previously agreed on- the only “facts” belong to mathematics. Everything else inherently requires some degree of faith. For example, you know that 2+2=4, but you believe that the material world is all there is.
quote:
It would be like trying to convince a purple haired college educated democrat that illegal immigration, restrictive gun laws, out of control spending, and censorship are bad.
We agree again. It is the same mindset. It’s an extremist mindset. All religions require it. Pro Tip: Atheism, scientism, secularism, etc, are all religions. I wish I could find the video, but I saw one where Dawkins made this exact claim, and then was asked what it would take to convince him that God exists- and that blind fool couldn’t see that his reasoning was identical to the tranny’s.
I’m sure he’s a brilliant scientist, but he absolutely sucks at any form of philosophy. You guys really need to stay in your lane. 
quote:
This is where you are wrong, though I realize there’s no way to convince you.
Likewise. But the Christian worldview accounts for this. God is in control. That’s why I don’t freak out about whether or not I think someone is going to hell. I just do my job and trust Management. It really just boils down to who you think God is. You think He’s some egomaniac, and I think, that He probably knows some things that I don’t. It’s called “humility.” You should try it sometime.
quote:
I’m an open minded person and I have no dogma
I think the term “blind spot” applies here. You don’t know what you don’t know. Let’s define terms.
Open-minded: adjective
1- having or showing a mind receptive to new ideas or arguments.
2- unprejudiced; unbigoted; impartial.
I’ll grant you the first one, but 2 is impossible to achieve given the implications of the conclusions.
Dogma: noun
1- an official system of principles or tenets concerning faith, morals, behavior, etc., as of a church.
2- a specific tenet or doctrine authoritatively laid down, as by a church:
the dogma of the Assumption;
the recently defined dogma of papal infallibility.
3- prescribed doctrine proclaimed as unquestionably true by a particular group:
the difficulty of resisting political dogma.
4- a settled or established opinion, belief, or principle:
the classic dogma of objectivity in scientific observation.
3 and 4 is all you bro. You are not completely open minded. No one is. You have dogmas. Everyone does. Two things are important here- to understand the difference between fact and faith, and to understand the consequences of misplaced belief.
quote:
I only believe what I do because I have a very good understanding of the natural world due to my scientific education and my own research
If all of the knowledge that could be had was a pie- how many slices would you say you’ve eaten?
quote:
and I have thoroughly studied the Bibles
Looking for contradictions and reasons to doubt? Sure. Granted. What I disagree with is that you claim you have no dog in this fight.
quote:
The difference between my presuppositions and yours (and Champagne’s and Foo’s) is that my presuppositions get tested and if the evidence disproves my presuppositions
False. And you’re not gonna like how I prove it. You don’t acknowledge that there is some objective standard of morality. Yet, no matter how many times a child is raped- it’s ALWAYS wrong. Objectively.
This post was edited on 2/22/25 at 9:49 am
Posted on 2/22/25 at 10:57 am to Prodigal Son
quote:
As we have previously agreed on- the only “facts” belong to mathematics.
Hold on there, I think we agreed “proofs” belong to mathematics. We can still have facts, like the fact that humans and chimps evolved from a common ancestor over millions of years as explained by the (scientific) theory of evolution.
quote:
Pro Tip: Atheism, scientism, secularism, etc, are all religions
False. Is someone who does not collect stamps… a stamp collector? Is someone who doesn’t play baseball, a baseball player? A-theism is literally without-religion.
quote:
Dawkins
You know he’s not “our” Pope, right?
quote:
You guys really need to stay in your lane
Tell that to FooLaneCraig who insists the earth is 6000 years if you really believe science and philosophy cannot commingle.
quote:
You think He’s some egomaniac,
It’s obvious that the fictive character of Yahweh (though not El) as described in most of the OT is a jealous, murderous, egomaniac.
quote:
3- prescribed doctrine proclaimed as unquestionably true by a particular group: the difficulty of resisting political dogma. 4- a settled or established opinion, belief, or principle: the classic dogma of objectivity in scientific observation. 3 and 4 is all you bro. You are not completely open minded.
Wrong. I have no doctrines, opinions, beliefs, or principles that are unquestionably true. Now I have facts and evidence, not to be confused with doctrines and opinions. I think you are trying to equivocate doctrines with facts. I have no dogmas. Show me where I’m wrong and why, and I have no choice but to change my views. If I show where you are wrong, or where the Bible is wrong, your dogma takes away your ability to comprehend rationally and you are incapable of changing a view. I can admit I’m wrong and be happy that I now have better understanding about a topic. You cannot.
quote:
If all of the knowledge that could be had was a pie- how many slices would you say you’ve eaten?
Irrelevant. But in that part of the you haven’t eaten, maybe that’s where the evidence all your Bible is fictive resides and you just haven’t eaten it yet.
quote:
Looking for contradictions and reasons to doubt? Sure. Granted. What I disagree with is that you claim you have no dog in this fight.
I don’t, but if Yahweh himself were to reveal himself and threaten me with conscious eternal torture, I would drop to my knees and worship that evil jealous god so that I could become a mindless automaton in heaven.
quote:
Yet, no matter how many times a child is raped- it’s ALWAYS wrong
Not according to your Bible. Kidnap, rape, and murder of young girls are all endorsed by Yahweh under certain circumstances. So therefore to you it is sometimes right and sometimes wrong. Therefore it is not objectively right or wrong. There is no objectivity in your “objective moral standard”.
Posted on 2/22/25 at 11:19 am to RollTide1987
And now for something completely different, it looks like his precipitous decline is an open topic of discussion.
Loading Twitter/X Embed...
If tweet fails to load, click here.Posted on 2/22/25 at 8:17 pm to Squirrelmeister
quote:
Hold on there, I think we agreed “proofs” belong to mathematics. We can still have facts, like the fact that humans and chimps evolved from a common ancestor over millions of years as explained by the (scientific) theory of evolution
Hold on there, that’s not a fact. Darwin’s theory relies on the “inference to the best explanation,” which is just a fancy way of saying “I believe.” Far from fact, UCA (universal common ancestor) is a highly debated theory. Facts are not debatable. The fact that UCA is debate (among the scientific community), inherently implies that UCA is not, in fact, a fact. Your dogma is showing.
quote:
False. Is someone who does not collect stamps… a stamp collector? Is someone who doesn’t play baseball, a baseball player? A-theism is literally without-religion.
Fair point, but I think you missed mine. Atheism/scentism does not necessarily mimic all aspects of religion, but it fills the same void. It serves the same purpose. All are the means by which we make sense of the world around us. None of which are provable beyond doubt.
quote:
Dawkins- You know he’s not “our” Pope, right?
Sure. But you all share many of the same dogmas.
quote:
Tell that to FooLaneCraig who insists the earth is 6000 years if you really believe science and philosophy cannot commingle.
The earth absolutely could be roughly 6000 years old. Or, it could be 4 billion years old. It doesn’t matter to me. I actually think both sides make pretty good arguments, that neither side can fully refute. Both positions require faith. That is the main takeaway. quote:
It’s obvious that the fictive character of Yahweh (though not El) as described in most of the OT is a jealous, murderous, egomaniac.
Or, He’s a truly loving Father who knows and wants what’s best for His children; and is guiding them towards full maturity- despite our best efforts to defy Him. He uses our free will decisions to accomplish His purpose. He is a righteous Judge, who doles out mercy and justice according to His perfect will. If He is who He says He is- then I recognize who I am, in relation, and I put my trust in Him. If He’s not who He says He is- we’re all screwed anyway. Not to mention how ridiculous it is to judge morality without an objective standard to hold it against.
You:
quote:
Wrong. I have no doctrines, opinions, beliefs, or principles that are unquestionably true.
Also you five minutes ago:
quote:
We can still have facts, like the fact that humans and chimps evolved from a common ancestor over millions of years
I could leave it there. But I won’t. I enjoy our conversations.
quote:
Show me where I’m wrong and why
You’re not open minded. You continuously demonstrate otherwise. When provided with logical and plausible explanations for all of your supposed and perceived contradictions, you deny them as such. Instead of giving you pause, they force you into the comforting arms of critical scholarship that reinforces your fragile scientific materialism. If you were truly open minded, you’d have no problem admitting that there might be some objective standard of morality by which we judge everything. But you can’t. Because you can’t afford to be wrong. You live in a house of cards.
You’re equally as dogmatic as those you criticize. You are inextricably bound to the idea that the material world is all that exists, and that something came from nothing; via a totally random, undirected cosmic accident- and yet you still trust that random accumulation of unintelligent molecules that you call a brain to be able to decipher truth in reality. Irony. You use scientific consensus the same way a theist uses the Bible. Circular reasoning and arguments from authority are your greatest strengths.
quote:
Irrelevant
Really? So, questioning the knowledge of someone who is making a knowledge claim is irrelevant? More likely, this destroys your “probability” argument, which directly hurts your pride, causing you to avoid confrontation by redirecting the conversation to me. This is a sign of weakness. It’s literally what children do. Answer the question and defend yourself.
quote:
I don’t,
Seriously? You don’t look for contradictions and difficult passages to exploit the perceived misbehavior of the God you don’t believe in? Your post history says otherwise.
quote:
if Yahweh himself were to reveal himself and threaten me with conscious eternal torture, I would drop to my knees and worship that evil jealous god so that I could become a mindless automaton in heaven.
Clearly, you don’t know what worship means. Let me help you. Take the way you feel about scientific materialism- how it solves all your problems and brings you peace and happiness. Now, explain to me how God threatening you would make you all of a sudden feel that way towards Him.
quote:
Not according to your Bible
Another deflection. Misdirection is more accurate. You know the Bible doesn’t condone those things. You just need something shocking to take the focus off of how insufficient atheism is at doing anything other than destruction.
Posted on 2/22/25 at 9:18 pm to Prodigal Son
replacement pope
Posted on 2/22/25 at 9:29 pm to Squirrelmeister
quote:
as I have come to find out that there is no amount of evidence, facts, logic, or reason that will convince the other side.
Your evidence is shortcomings and logic is retarded.
But your projection is fire.
Posted on 2/22/25 at 9:48 pm to RollTide1987
FRICK THE POPE!
So tired of that false tradition, he’s a pedo supporting evil POS!
Let him die & dissolve the catholic hoax and let’s take back all the land they stole for so many decades upon decades!
And I grew up catholic
Grammar school
High school
College
But I’ve seen enough of the BS!
A bunch of groomers on young boys & they keep every entity in separate LLC’s or Corps that way the lawsuits don’t attack to the big money bag!!
Frick the POPE, who cares
So tired of that false tradition, he’s a pedo supporting evil POS!
Let him die & dissolve the catholic hoax and let’s take back all the land they stole for so many decades upon decades!
And I grew up catholic
Grammar school
High school
College
But I’ve seen enough of the BS!
A bunch of groomers on young boys & they keep every entity in separate LLC’s or Corps that way the lawsuits don’t attack to the big money bag!!
Frick the POPE, who cares
Posted on 2/22/25 at 10:02 pm to Snipe
quote:
If you wish death on this Pope you are neither Catholic or Christian but do the work of your father who knows no truth.
Wonder if Peter, who Catholics built their so called church on, wished death on the guard that lost an ear? Something to consider.
Posted on 2/22/25 at 10:12 pm to Squirrelmeister
quote:
Tell that to FooLaneCraig who insists the earth is 6000 years if you really believe science and philosophy cannot commingle.
I didn’t read the entire thread but you’re 100% dead wrong on this. You sir, have done little to zero of your own research. I enjoy these debates but don’t throw stupid shite like this out to distort facts, it basically just shows your ignorance on the subject at hand.
Posted on 2/22/25 at 10:23 pm to catholictigerfan
quote:
Pope Francis health is improving
Not now. He had a "respiratory crisis".
Pope Francis is in critical condition after a long respiratory crisis, requiring oxygen at high flow
Posted on 2/23/25 at 12:23 am to Prodigal Son
quote:
Hold on there, that’s not a fact. Darwin’s theory relies on the “inference to the best explanation,” which is just a fancy way of saying “I believe.” Far from fact, UCA (universal common ancestor) is a highly debated theory. Facts are not debatable. The fact that UCA is debate (among the scientific community), inherently implies that UCA is not, in fact, a fact. Your dogma is showing.
PS, I don’t know where you get your information from, but your comments are looney. Darwin had a hypothesis, not a theory, and he wasn’t able to fully test it. Now that we have learned a great deal more through paleontology, geology, and genetics, and have thoroughly tested the hypothesis, all the best data overwhelming shows that evolution from a common ancestor is a fact. The theory of evolution is a body of evidence which explains that fact. This is no longer debated amongst legitimate scientists (excluding looney nut jobs who get credentialed just to be the 0.1% of “scientists” who “debate” the issue). In fact, the theory of biological evolution of species is the most understood body of evidence and facts about anything in the natural world. It’s the foundation of modern medicine. No dogma.
quote:
scentism
quote:
The earth absolutely could be roughly 6000 years old
The Yazidis have been keeping a calendar much longer than 6000 years, and their calendar was unharmed by “Noah’s flood”. Look, this FooLaneCraig young earth stuff is just silly and childish and can only exist through cognitive dissonance.
quote:
Or, He’s a truly loving Father who knows and wants what’s best for His children; and is guiding them towards full maturity- despite our best efforts to defy Him. He uses our free will decisions to accomplish His purpose. He is a righteous Judge, who doles out mercy and justice according to His perfect will.
PS, re-read your statement and then just read Exodus 32. Let me help you out though. The Israelites make golden images - idols - to be used to worship Yahweh, and have a feast in honor of Yahweh, while Moses is on the mountain (which mountain? Sinai, not Horeb in this version of the story). Moses is getting the commandments, the very commandments which prohibit idols and all graven images. But he hasn’t presented the Israelites with that commandment yet, because when they make the golden bulls, Moses is still on the mountain. Then that very loving father who wants the best for his children… has some of the Levites murder 3000 Israelites as punishment for a law they did not know. Oh yeah and he also sends a very great plague but it doesn’t say how many die. What a great injustice… murders his children for a sin they did not and could not know was a sin. Only cognitive dissonance can explain why you can’t accept that.
In reality, idols of Yahweh were the normal method of worship used in Israel and Judah up to the Persian period when it became somewhat discouraged in Jerusalem but still prospered in the countryside. And we know this from archaeological evidence.
quote:
Really? So, questioning the knowledge of someone who is making a knowledge claim is irrelevant? More likely, this destroys your “probability” argument, which directly hurts your pride, causing you to avoid confrontation by redirecting the conversation to me
I’ve seen the apologist tactic of the pie, and it is irrelevant and a poor argument. “So you don’t know everything there is to know, aha! So in that knowable knowledge you don’t know that’s where you can find Jesus!” Not interested.
Posted on 2/23/25 at 12:24 am to Duffnshank
quote:
you’re 100% dead wrong on this.
On what? Could you be more precise and explain your assertion?
Posted on 2/23/25 at 12:28 am to Squirrelmeister
Surely, he absolutely talks about the age of the earth, he doesn’t believe believe it’s 6000 yes old, neither does anyone else. I think you might be referring to Ken Ham
Posted on 2/23/25 at 1:05 am to Duffnshank
quote:I think it's roughly that old, yes.
Surely, he absolutely talks about the age of the earth, he doesn’t believe believe it’s 6000 yes old, neither does anyone else. I think you might be referring to Ken Ham
Posted on 2/23/25 at 1:13 am to Prodigal Son
quote:quote:Another deflection. Misdirection is more accurate. You know the Bible doesn’t condone those things. You just need something shocking to take the focus off of how insufficient atheism is at doing anything other than destruction.
Not according to your Bible
Let’s see who is doing the deflecting.
Remember this?
quote:quote:Not according to your Bible. Kidnap, rape, and murder of young girls are all endorsed by Yahweh under certain circumstances. So therefore to you it is sometimes right and sometimes wrong. Therefore it is not objectively right or wrong. There is no objectivity in your “objective moral standard”.
Yet, no matter how many times a child is raped- it’s ALWAYS wrong
Ok I don’t even need to do any digging or citing multiple sources. Just reference Numbers 31. After the Israelites murder all the men, married women, and boys including babies, they take the rest of the girls (virgins) against their will (KIDNAP). Then they take many of them as wives (RAPE). Taking as a wife is a euphemism for “going in unto them” with their wieners. So even though they’d already murdered a bunch of young married girls, then they take 32 of the virgins and (MURDER) them too by offering them to Yahweh [as a burnt offering on an altar as was customary].
Now don’t think about saying the LORD didn’t tell them to do all that evil shite and didn’t endorse it. In fact, the LORD keeps tabs on Moses the whole time talking back and forth with Moses telling Moses what to do. And Moses did what the LORD commandeth. Yahweh endorsed all of that evil including accepting the sacrifice of virgin girls, 32 to be exact.
Posted on 2/23/25 at 1:15 am to Duffnshank
quote:
Surely, he absolutely talks about the age of the earth, he doesn’t believe believe it’s 6000 yes old
Before I could suggest you ask him yourself, he had already cleared it up for you.
Thanks Foo
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