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re: What Would a Grand Bargain Look Like?
Posted on 5/3/18 at 6:26 am to JudgeHolden
Posted on 5/3/18 at 6:26 am to JudgeHolden
quote:
I get it. I'm trying to figure out what the left could do to make that better
They could begin to Value individual freedom. They could begin to recognize that individual freedom comes with normal human things that are imperfect. They could begin to recognize that their attempts to Stamp Out individual Freedom just change what's not perfect
Individual Freedom should be the Paramount value in this country above all else. Until the left can come around 2 that there is no compromise
And let me be clear. Unlike the left I'm willing to let the left behave in accordance with their beliefs. I'm just asking that they return the favor
0
Posted on 5/3/18 at 6:27 am to JudgeHolden
quote:
I am. I honestly don't think the gays are worried about Trump as an individual. I think they are worried that Trump would not pushback against his party on gay rights.
Identity politics will be the death of this nation
Posted on 5/3/18 at 6:27 am to JudgeHolden
quote:
Ok. Flip it. Suppose the dems abandon Planned Parenthood and renounce it completely. What would you give up to get that?
I’d let them build the wall and further restrict immigration, like they wanted so desperately to do just a short time ago. Back when demographic data said it was politically expedient for them.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 6:28 am to JudgeHolden
quote:
Trump would not pushback against his party on gay rights.
Gays don't want gay rights. Gays want to force everyone else to disregard their own points of view on an individual basis.
Individual freedom. Learn to love it. It will be good for the left to
Posted on 5/3/18 at 6:38 am to JudgeHolden
Let me ask a few simple questions.
Is the left okay with it when a female business owner prioritizes hiring only females 2 top management roles?
How about when a black owner does it with blacks?
Is the left okay with it if a gay person doesn't want to do business with Ann Coulter?
Is the left okay with it if a Jew doesn't want to do business with David Duke?
On an even simpler note is the left okay with it if a black person looking for a roommate seeks out other black people to be his roommate?
I could go on for probably hundreds of these and I suspect the answer and every single case is yes
To which I say good. I'm totally okay with it too because I value individual freedom. So I ask that you return the favor
Is the left okay with it when a female business owner prioritizes hiring only females 2 top management roles?
How about when a black owner does it with blacks?
Is the left okay with it if a gay person doesn't want to do business with Ann Coulter?
Is the left okay with it if a Jew doesn't want to do business with David Duke?
On an even simpler note is the left okay with it if a black person looking for a roommate seeks out other black people to be his roommate?
I could go on for probably hundreds of these and I suspect the answer and every single case is yes
To which I say good. I'm totally okay with it too because I value individual freedom. So I ask that you return the favor
Posted on 5/3/18 at 6:51 am to JudgeHolden
The best way of working this out peacefully is to split the country up. West America can do what it wants, Dixie can do what it wants, and Yankee can do what it wants. Each new nation starts with the existing constitution and has an immediate constitutional convention to amend it howsoever the member states see fit. People are given one year to relocate to the new nation of their choice at which point they become citizens of the new nation. Military personnel likewise have up to 90 days to request a transfer to the armed forces of a new nation and military hardware would be reapportioned based on the size of the resulting militaries.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 6:53 am to Boatshoes
This nation is going to balkanize but it's not going to be nearly that clean
Posted on 5/3/18 at 6:53 am to JudgeHolden
quote:
What I mean by put it aside is that we assume we can all agree to amend the Constitution to conform to whatever deal we cut.
I don't think we need to amend the Constitution.
Issue by issue would take forever, but I'd be willing to yield a bit on some Dem favorites provided more accountability and higher standards came into play. For example, the Dept of Ed and teachers unions - have some teachers that are worth a damn and face accountability, and produce an educational system that puts us at the top, and sure, I'd be willing to see even more money obligated in that direction through the budget. Failing an increase in standards and performance and I believe it's time to destroy the Dept of Ed and take it down to about 25% of its current size and scope.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 7:00 am to Boatshoes
quote:
The best way of working this out peacefully is to split the country up.
Seems like we tried that once.
My ancestors fought for the South, to the end. So I'm not to keen on that proposal.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 7:01 am to JudgeHolden
quote:
Ok, say the Dems all come in and say "We will leave the Christians alone if they will leave us alone on gays/trans
"If they will leave us alone on gay/trans"
Does this mean putting the gays and translunatics in camps?
I'm for that.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 7:01 am to starsandstripes
I honestly believe there's a deal to be made on most standard how we run government type issues
The fundamental break comes with the fact that identity politics have taken over the left. And that breeds the election of completely intransigent people.
I know tons of liberals in my own life that sound fairly conservative if we're talking about things like Federal involvement in education and things like that
Sure there are friends elements on both sides that would still be impossible to work with but absent identity politics I don't think those folks will be very relevant
The fundamental break comes with the fact that identity politics have taken over the left. And that breeds the election of completely intransigent people.
I know tons of liberals in my own life that sound fairly conservative if we're talking about things like Federal involvement in education and things like that
Sure there are friends elements on both sides that would still be impossible to work with but absent identity politics I don't think those folks will be very relevant
Posted on 5/3/18 at 7:01 am to auggie
quote:
"If they will leave us alone on gay/trans" Does this mean putting the gays and translunatics in camps? I'm for that.
That's going to be a tough sell. But say it could be done. What's your trade?
Posted on 5/3/18 at 7:03 am to JudgeHolden
quote:
My ancestors fought for the South, to the end. So I'm not to keen on that proposal
Our nation is destined to balkanize. When it happens I don't think a shot will be fired.
Everybody assumes it's going to be something like the South seceding again or something but I don't think it's going to be anything like that.
We just aren't an individual country anymore and it's only going to get worse.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 7:03 am to ShortyRob
quote:
I honestly believe there's a deal to be made on most standard how we run government type issues The fundamental break comes with the fact that identity politics have taken over the left. And that breeds the election of completely intransigent people.
I mostly agree. But I'd add that a form of identity politics has taken over most sides.
The question is how deep it runs. And that's why I'm thinking about the bargain. It's really just a way of looking at what is most important to both sides. It's like forced ranking.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 7:04 am to JudgeHolden
quote:
That's going to be a tough sell. But say it could be done. What's your trade
I giving you my trade but you don't seem very interested in responding my posts all of a sudden
My trade is super simple. I 100% support you're right to individual freedom and I simply ask that you return the favor
This post was edited on 5/3/18 at 7:07 am
Posted on 5/3/18 at 7:06 am to ShortyRob
quote:
I giving you my trade but you don't seem very interested in responding my posts all of a sudden
Sorry, brah. Got some business shite to do early this am.
I'll try to respond later today. I'm serious about the question.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 7:06 am to JudgeHolden
quote:
I mostly agree. But I'd add that a form of identity politics has taken over most sides.
It had to. The left has built a situation where the government has segmented off certain groups for special protection while simultaneously telling all the other groups to go frick themselves
And then they called all of the people in the other groups racist who sat up and took notice
That's going to tend to cause identity Politics on the other side out of simple self-preservation
quote:
It's really just a way of looking at what is most important to both sides. It's like forced ranking.
I keep telling you
Individual freedom
Posted on 5/3/18 at 7:08 am to JudgeHolden
quote:
Jesus and I are straight.)
Dont think he's straight with abortion supporters. Not at all.
Posted on 5/3/18 at 7:12 am to JudgeHolden
quote:
That's going to be a tough sell. But say it could be done. What's your trade?
That was the trade. You suggested it. You backing out?
Posted on 5/3/18 at 7:19 am to JudgeHolden
Ronald Reagen taught us not to negotiate with terrorist.
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