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2
Posted on 4/18/21 at 7:43 pm to DByrd2
quote:
Are they really delusional if they can actually pull it off?
They won't pull it off. You're not going to get the locals of these clubs all over Europe to spend the same amount of money via their advertising power. You'll see some areas like South America where there will be no drop off, but inside Europe, they absolutely won't pull it off in the long run. It's literally the exact same thinking that got us the Longhorn Network.
Posted on 4/18/21 at 7:43 pm to TeLeFaWx
quote:
Which I don't think you get. Designing a system that is the most robust and healthiest is the goal. Sure, the big 6 might seize a relatively larger share with this Super League to the rest of their English counterparts, but if the consumers value other forms of entertainment more, then voila, 80% of a grape is less than 40% of a watermelon.
In a free market, those consumers will decide what was the best product overall. That only happens in open, competitive markets with multiple options.
The reason I am harping on it is because someone took the stance that this Super League was going to be a direct competitor of the UCL.
Sometimes a market is volatile and all parties aren't working together to make whatever it is better for everyone involved. It's a fact of life.
They (UEFA) are pissed that someone else is making money off of soccer without including the them.
Posted on 4/18/21 at 7:44 pm to DByrd2
quote:
So you aren't allowed to franchise anything without the permission of existing competing franchises? THAT is closed system.
Operating by rules that you agree to willingly isn't a closed system. Again, what is UEFA?
quote:
Seems to me that the Americans who "fail to understand" are making a free market play in reaction to (and to compete with) a closed system
My god man. 'Let me just spend 35 million on Granit Xhaka and Mustafi again. Oh I don't like this. I shouldn't be allowed to suffer the effects of my poor decisions!'
It doesn't sound like any free market principles are at play, honestly.
quote:
You're mixing up things again. Is it fair? Maybe not. I'd even
'Yes someone else built this, and I'll try to ensure my poor decisions won't affect the value of the club, because I love a free market. Having actual talent or skill is beside the point here. What is important is that I protect my investment.'
To be clear, you are saying moving from a system which these clubs willfully agreed to is a closed system (which implies that any regulation is a closed system, which isn't a position that even Adam Smith argued) to a clearly closed system where they cannot fail is free market. They are moving from the freer market to the less free one. You understand that, right?
Posted on 4/18/21 at 7:44 pm to dirtytigers
I don’t know. I don’t think things were really out of control until everyone had money. May see it as the Super League teams try to outspend each other, but I don’t know how much some of the “smaller” teams will be able to dictate prices. There’s always the “frick you, I’m going to see out my contract and leave for free” option that teams have to contend with
Posted on 4/18/21 at 7:45 pm to bkPoseidon
quote:
You think they can pull off their own World Cup?!
I personally don't care if they can or not. I think they are free to try and free to fail, that is thewhole point of my argument.
Is it fair if they can and they succeed? No. But in that scenario they did, so the market has to deal with it at that point.
Posted on 4/18/21 at 7:46 pm to DByrd2
quote:
Did the clubs agree specifically not to frick off and form their own league?
Are they still members of UEFA? Please tell me who makes up UEFA and you will answer this question.
quote:
It seems like you are trying to hold them to rules, regulations, and laws that don't exis
These regulations do exist, and these clubs willfully agreed to them. Again, what is UEFA?
Posted on 4/18/21 at 7:47 pm to crazy4lsu
If the domestic leagues and tourneys take a stand and ban these teams, their investment is not protected. That's not that hard to understand. You're arguing with emotion.
Posted on 4/18/21 at 7:49 pm to DByrd2
Again, I keep asking for a simple definition of what UEFA is, which will answer your question about what is a closed system and what isn't, or whether these clubs agreed to rules and regulations regarding their behavior.
Posted on 4/18/21 at 7:52 pm to DByrd2
quote:I don't any of us care who gets the money. Basically every regular long time poster on this board has railed against FIFA and UEFA in the past. None of us are trying to protect those organizations. We are concerned about how it may affect the sport.
Did the clubs agree specifically not to frick off and form their own league?
It seems like you are trying to hold them to rules, regulations, and laws that don't exist but are rather emotionally-based opinions on fairness of their investment.
This post was edited on 4/18/21 at 7:55 pm
Posted on 4/18/21 at 7:52 pm to DByrd2
quote:
In a free market, those consumers will decide what was the best product overall. That only happens in open, competitive markets with multiple options.
Yes. Markets are a thing. But clearly you're missing the point that the fact is these owners can undermine their product to their own detriment. Just because it's a "market" response doesn't mean it's a good idea. The AOL Time Warner merger was a market response. Blockbuster not buying Netflix was a market response. You're conflating "market response" with "general business idea done by retarded consultants that don't understand the market beyond financial statements and see a short term doubling of revenue for certain clubs but don't get how that is going to siphon away the base of their market".
quote:
The reason I am harping on it is because someone took the stance that this Super League was going to be a direct competitor of the UCL.
Since the games will happen on Wednesdays, and the teams won't compete in both, then duh. That's exactly what's going to happen. That's the point. You have to design a system, and system designs compromise other designs because the whole space time continuum thing.
quote:
Sometimes a market is volatile and all parties aren't working together to make whatever it is better for everyone involved. It's a fact of life.
Sure.
quote:
They (UEFA) are pissed that someone else is making money off of soccer without including the them.
Also people that like understand the mechanics of forced consolidation and how it destroys grassroots efforts. Infrastructure is a thing and this cripples it. Longhorn Network all over again.
Posted on 4/18/21 at 7:55 pm to Draconian Sanctions
Socialism in soccer smh
Posted on 4/18/21 at 8:02 pm to crazy4lsu
quote:
Again, I keep asking for a simple definition of what UEFA is, which will answer your question about what is a closed system and what isn't, or whether these clubs agreed to rules and regulations regarding their behavior.
None of that fricking matters at all if they didn't agree specifically to not form something in the model of this Super League.
Posted on 4/18/21 at 8:03 pm to TeLeFaWx
quote:
Also people that like understand the mechanics of forced consolidation and how it destroys grassroots efforts.
How dare they! Any willfully agreed upon rules that this dude just learned is straight up socialism, and a bunch of retard boomers who can destroy the game through their greed are just free market entrepreneurs who didn't agree to these bylaws specifically!
Posted on 4/18/21 at 8:04 pm to DByrd2
quote:
None of that fricking matters at all if they didn't agree specifically to not form something in the model of this Super League.
My god dude. You keep making my point for me, and you think you are making the opposite point.
Posted on 4/18/21 at 8:05 pm to ohiovol
quote:
I don't any of us care who gets the money. Basically every regular long time poster on this board has railed against FIFA and UEFA in the past. None of us are trying to protect those organizations. We are concerned about how it may affect the sport.
I am concerned about it as well. I just disagree with the idea that there people are not free to do something like this because of greed. It sounds hypocritical to scream about greed because someone had an idea to make money that others didn't. That's UEFA In this case.
I see potential for it to hurt the game. But I also doubt that the game dies because of this.
Posted on 4/18/21 at 8:07 pm to crazy4lsu
If that's the case, we've been arguing the same thing the whole time.
You've either been scant on details yourself, or you missed my point entirely.
I could give a frick about fairness. These owners didn't just kill the game. You're being delusional if you think so. That clear up my argument, since you want to be all sensitive and get worked up?
You've either been scant on details yourself, or you missed my point entirely.
I could give a frick about fairness. These owners didn't just kill the game. You're being delusional if you think so. That clear up my argument, since you want to be all sensitive and get worked up?
Posted on 4/18/21 at 8:07 pm to DByrd2
Time traveling Mario
Posted on 4/18/21 at 8:09 pm to crazy4lsu
quote:
Any willfully agreed upon rules that this dude just learned is straight up socialism
You're not wrong. If you like socialism and disagree with my principles that I agree with, then kindly frick off instead of trying to force feed a 30 year old conservative guy.
Side Question: Does it really bother some people that much when you have a neutral opinion that isn't emotionally driven?
This post was edited on 4/18/21 at 8:13 pm
Posted on 4/18/21 at 8:10 pm to TeLeFaWx
quote:
Just because it's a "market" response doesn't mean it's a good idea.
Never argued it is a good idea. Just that they aren't some evil entity for taking the opportunity they saw.
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