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BringThePaine
| Favorite team: | |
| Location: | Omnipresent |
| Biography: | |
| Interests: | Truth and Objective Analysis |
| Occupation: | Gardener of Ideas |
| Number of Posts: | 39 |
| Registered on: | 4/17/2021 |
| Online Status: | Not Online |
Recent Posts
Message
re: You think Derek wins an appeal?
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 6:53 pm to ninthward
quote:Biden is not a particularly intelligent individual, and this statement provides good evidence in support of that assertion, but "how did it affect the verdict?" Did a juror hear him?
The president telling the world he hopes for the right verdict. Maybe start there Matlock?
If not, it has no bearing on the case whatsoever. Same with Mensa Waters.
0
re: You think Derek wins an appeal?
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 6:50 pm to texashorn
quote:Over/under on the DV count?
An appeal of what? What was the procedural defect?
I've got "over" at 50.
re: I bet that female officer who accidentally shot that dirtbag is terrified now
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 6:49 pm to lsualum96
quote:A lot of people seem to think that the criminal law works like the rules on a preschool playground.
This is literally NOT how the law works. Y'all crack me up.
Maybe we would have a better system if the criminal law DID work that way, but it just doesn't.
re: Prosecutor Tearfully Addresses Each Juror By Name, Phone Number, And Street Address
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 6:37 pm to Deplorableinohio
quote:Lord help us.
This can’t be true. Right?
re: JUST IN: Fatal officer-involved shooting Columbus, OH. 15yr old girl dead...
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 6:34 pm to lsuguy84
quote:Or it may have been the one where two cops saw a kid sleeping alone in a park with his head on a picnic table ten minutes after getting a call and had no way of knowing whether the sleeping kid was even a suspect, so they drove off the street with into the park and to within a few feet of the kid, and then shot him when he stood up and before their car even came to a complete stop.quote:Is that the one who was pointing the toy gun at people and then pulled it out of his waistband when the cop showed up?
Tamir Rice
All a matter of perspective, I suppose.
re: Kyle Rittenhouse is Done
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 6:27 pm to xGeauxLSUx
re: JUST IN: Fatal officer-involved shooting Columbus, OH. 15yr old girl dead...
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 6:21 pm to Indefatigable
quote:You are probably correct, but one's memory drifts to Tamir Rice.
0.0006 seconds of critical thinking and common sense leads to the conclusion that the cop probably didn’t drive up, step out of the vehicle, and immediately start shooting....
re: Kyle Rittenhouse is Done
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 6:16 pm to tarzana
quote:I normally like reading your posts, because it is refreshing to see another viewpoint here, but I am forced to assume that you are trolling a bit in this post.quote:Heaven help us. I can't believe I actually read this! Now I know I'm living in some form of alternate reality.
No sane person would say he wasn't justified
Yes, it was bonehead stupid for Rittenhouse to have injected himself into this situation with a firearm, but we have all watched the video, and I have not seen any instance of him handling it in a provocative or threatening manner toward anyone who was not threatening toward him first. In BOTH encounters, he attempted to withdraw and was pursued before employing his weapon.
He was stupid to be there, but (once arrived) he acted in near-textbook self-defense during each encounter.
re: JUST IN: Fatal officer-involved shooting Columbus, OH. 15yr old girl dead...
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 6:07 pm to xGeauxLSUx
quote:It was a joke. His uniform shirt is white, rather than blue.quote:Meaning...??
Given his uniform, probably best that he was not more specific ....
Can you imagine the officer saying "White Lives Matter" in that crowd?
re: I bet that female officer who accidentally shot that dirtbag is terrified now
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 6:03 pm to OMLandshark
quote:I feel badly for her, too. She made a horrible mistake, and someone died.quote:I mean, she’s being properly charged and is quite frankly as far as I can see guilty of 2nd degree manslaughter.
I bet that female officer who accidentally shot that dirtbag is terrified now. She has two young kids. I feel bad for this woman, and her family.
In this country, police are not immune from the law, and the law frowns upon them accidentally shooting suspects with the wrong weapon. This looks like yet another case in which the prosecutor COULD have appeased the mob by overcharging the officer, but declined to do so.
re: JUST IN: Fatal officer-involved shooting Columbus, OH. 15yr old girl dead...
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 5:58 pm to xGeauxLSUx
quote:Given his uniform, probably best that he was not more specific ....
They say that after the shooting one of the other officers said "Blue Lives Matter"....
re: JUST IN: Fatal officer-involved shooting Columbus, OH. 15yr old girl dead...
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 5:46 pm to xGeauxLSUx
So, based upon the limited information set forth in the OP, it seems that the decedent was using a knife to defend herself from some sort of assault or attack, during which she called the police, then the officer arrived and thought that she (the caller) was an aggressor?
Let's say that she DID get assaulted and that she DID call the authorities. The police cruiser arrives, and she runs toward them, thinking she is safe (but still brandishing the knife). The officer misinterprets and shoots her as she runs toward him. Plausible.
Looking forward to the bodycam files on this one.
Let's say that she DID get assaulted and that she DID call the authorities. The police cruiser arrives, and she runs toward them, thinking she is safe (but still brandishing the knife). The officer misinterprets and shoots her as she runs toward him. Plausible.
Looking forward to the bodycam files on this one.
re: George Floyd will now ascend to Saint Hood
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 5:42 pm to goldennugget
quote:From the perspective of the activists, better a dead martyr now than a survivor who becomes a live villain when arrested again in another year or two.
George Floyd will now ascend to Saint Hood
Sad but true.
re: What this verdict should mean for police in Minneapolis
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 5:36 pm to SammyTiger
quote:Serious question here.
Maybe just don’t kneel on them till they die?
Let's set aside where Chauvin's knee may have been, whether Floyd had consumed a lethal quantity of a controlled substance, his oxygen levels and three hundred other matters irrelevant to the following:
Once Floyd was cuffed, why did Chauvin continue to kneel on him in any way whatsoever, rather than just sitting Floyd on the pavement with his hands cuffed behind him and his back to the vehicle?
I am sure this has been addressed at some point, but I've just not seen it.
re: So will BLM burn cities in celebration now?
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 5:16 pm to Lebowski
quote:Yes.
So will BLM burn cities in celebration now?
quote:
Can all the riot gear be returned?
I do not believe that would be wise.
re: Kyle Rittenhouse is Done
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 5:02 pm to Hayekian serf
quote:JoJo was one of the vertically challenged.
Did he kill a minority?
I honestly don’t remember
re: Kyle Rittenhouse is Done
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 4:59 pm to FMtTXtiger
quote:No offense intended, but what value do you see in adding a Constitutional scholar to a simple self-defense claim?
His team needs to ... add Alan D.
re: Kyle Rittenhouse is Done
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 4:56 pm to Roger Klarvin
quote:In one sense, I agree with you. The problem is that the procedural posture of the case and the burden of proof are so very, very different.
Rittenhouse killed a white sex offender who attacked him first, and is not someone in any position of authority over the person he killed. He’s got an exponentially better shot.
The State's only legal burden in the Rittenhouse case is basically to prove that the Defendant intended to point his weapon at someone and to pull the trigger with intent for the bullets to connect. The DA barely has to show up in court to meet that burden. Rittenhouse pointed his weapon center-mass, pulled the trigger and ventilated three people ... all on video.
At that point, the legal burden of proof shifts to the Defendant to PROVE that he was acting in self-defense. (In some states, the State has the burden to DISprove self-defense, but Wisconsin is NOT such a State).
In other words, it will be up to Rittenhouse's attorneys (NOT the State) to CONVINCE the jury of the key element of the case.
I believe he was acting in self-defense, and you probably believe he was acting in self-defense, but there will almost certainly be a few jurors VERY skeptical of that assertion, because they will see him as having voluntarily injected himself into those protests.
re: Was this another example of jury nullification?
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 4:44 pm to L1C4
quote:No.
Was this another example of jury nullification?
If the DA has pursued and the jury had convicted him of first degree homicide, you would have a strong argument that they ignored the facts presented to them and/or the judge's instructions regarding the law.
Given the lower level of intent associated with the three offenses that the DA actually charged in this case, that is a VERY difficult argument to make in good faith.
The state certainly charged him with everything they could reasonably have charged, but they did not over-charge. Result? They got a conviction.
re: To believe Chauvin is guilty of murder, you have to believe this.
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 4:30 pm to bhtigerfan
quote:And this is a good example of why it is so very difficult to have a reasonable discussion about ... well, anything ... in today's political climate. Someone with very little understanding of applicable law will ALWAYS make the sort of baseless assertion found in the OP ... and believe it with all of his being. Because his ideology requires him to hold that belief, no amount of objectively-correct information will ever cause most such persons to revise their viewpoints.
That a police officer knowingly murdered a person in broad daylight on a public street while numerous people were witnessing and filming him.
Kind of far fetched.
In truth, not ONE of the three crimes with which Officer Chauvin was charged requires the level of mens rea that the OP describes.
WHAT'S SECOND-DEGREE UNINTENTIONAL MURDER?
It's also called felony murder. To prove this count, prosecutors had to show that Chauvin killed Floyd while committing or trying to commit a felony — in this case, third-degree assault. They didn't have to prove Chauvin intended to kill Floyd, only that he intended to apply unlawful force that caused bodily harm.
WHAT ABOUT THIRD-DEGREE MURDER?
For this count, jurors must find Chauvin caused Floyd's death through an action that was “eminently dangerous” and carried out with a reckless disregard for and conscious indifference to the loss of life.
SECOND-DEGREE MANSLAUGHTER?
Prosecutors had to show that Chauvin caused Floyd's death through culpable negligence that created an unreasonable risk, and that he consciously took the chance of causing severe injury or death.
US News
re: Is there any PT members who believe Chauvin intentionally killed Floyd?
Posted by BringThePaine on 4/20/21 at 4:19 pm to Indefatigable
quote:WHAT'S SECOND-DEGREE UNINTENTIONAL MURDER?
neither murder charge required an intent to kill in order to convict. So I am not sure what you are going for here.
It's also called felony murder. To prove this count, prosecutors had to show that Chauvin killed Floyd while committing or trying to commit a felony — in this case, third-degree assault. They didn't have to prove Chauvin intended to kill Floyd, only that he intended to apply unlawful force that caused bodily harm.
WHAT ABOUT THIRD-DEGREE MURDER?
For this count, jurors must find Chauvin caused Floyd's death through an action that was “eminently dangerous” and carried out with a reckless disregard for and conscious indifference to the loss of life.
SECOND-DEGREE MANSLAUGHTER?
Prosecutors had to show that Chauvin caused Floyd's death through culpable negligence that created an unreasonable risk, and that he consciously took the chance of causing severe injury or death.
US News
A lot of posters are opining that Chauvin was NOT GUILTY, based upon a lack of intent. With all due respect, those posters should take a closer look at the elements of the three crimes on which he was convicted.
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