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Message
re: There is a ton of intellectual dishonesty regarding O
Posted on 12/7/16 at 5:28 pm to wildtigercat93
Posted on 12/7/16 at 5:28 pm to wildtigercat93
Can you name the big differences?
3
Posted on 12/7/16 at 5:41 pm to Topwater Trout
Well he's 11-4 as interim and 10-25 as a HC. Apparently there's some kind of difference. Hopefully, he's learned from those mistakes and does a great job.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 5:44 pm to HighRoller
I want all the posters spouting that to answer. I think most of them don't know what the frick they're talking about and being over dramatic
Posted on 12/7/16 at 5:45 pm to Topwater Trout
Maintaining the program with your players and your staff and your team. Expectations are completely different, building a roster for a start
It's one thing to come in and rally the troops and steer the ship in the right direction, it's another to be in control of creating the ship and mapping out the direction of the ship.
The fact that people want to crown O for losing two games with the second most talented team in the nation, while Miles was fired for doing the exact same, should properly demonstrate the stark differences between the two.
It's one thing to come in and rally the troops and steer the ship in the right direction, it's another to be in control of creating the ship and mapping out the direction of the ship.
The fact that people want to crown O for losing two games with the second most talented team in the nation, while Miles was fired for doing the exact same, should properly demonstrate the stark differences between the two.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 5:45 pm to Rou Leed
quote:
Jury is still out on Aranda but Reymond and Juluke and the like are the elite recruiters that have gotten talent here. They would have been impossible to replace and get equal productivity from new hires.
This may be the dumbest statement i've read in a while.
You don't hire a crap HC just to keep two position coaches. Hell, you dont even do it to keep Aranda TBH.
If Aranda was #1 priority, they should have hired him.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 5:52 pm to Rou Leed
quote:
I dont think Miles hired the staff. I am honestly not real sure what Miles should get credit for doing. I dont think he had much control of that the past couple years.
Damn, you keep beating your previous record of delusion.
Miles built every thing you see here today. In today's climate of College Football (the most competetive it's ever been), you dont win 78% without being VERY good at managing a program.
Otherwise, Will Muschamp, Charlie Strong, Brady Hoke, Lane Kiffin (USC), Ron Zook, Charlie Weis, etc etc etc would have all been successful. Their schools had just as dominate of a program as LSU is or has been. The only reason those teams sucked, is because the HC sucked.
I've got a feeling that in 10 years, you guys are going to realize just how good of a HC les really was, even with all his faults.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 5:59 pm to Topwater Trout
quote:
did you have the same number of conversations with their agents?
possibly.
we don't know if Alleva contacted any of them. We do know he didn't have face to face interviews.
quote:
Why haven't these guys changed jobs?
which of the openings this year would be considered definite steps up from their current gigs?
Texas? yes but they wanted only Herman
Oregon? probably (don't who they did or didn't interview)
LSU? yes. Alleva was all in on O
and that's it.
Purdue or Baylor would be lateral moves at best.
Houston is a step down from power 5. So is the now open USF, W Kentucky, and Temple jobs.
every one would express interest in the LSU job. even if just to play their current employer for a raise.
and you'll never convince me that not a single one was worthy of at least a face to face interview.
i mean not one?
Posted on 12/7/16 at 6:01 pm to SportTiger1
Les is the reason for everything bad in the world
Posted on 12/7/16 at 6:04 pm to Rou Leed
quote:
Ole Miss at that time was a dump.
You just make shite up dude. Cutcliffe won 10 games the year before he was fired. He had been recruiting top 30 classes, which is not far off from where O recruiting.
Houston Nutt actually recruited better than O, but no one wants to admit that.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 6:09 pm to Nutriaitch
Don't you think any coach that was interested in the LSU job would have had their agent gauge interest by LSU?
Don't you think some coaches will disqualify themselves based on their current contract and buyout...see Fuente and his 7 mil buyout
Houston didn't have a 2 month coaching search so it's a bit different when their season is over and coach has left to interview coaches...basically hey who is interested and select some to interview.
Don't you think some coaches will disqualify themselves based on their current contract and buyout...see Fuente and his 7 mil buyout
Houston didn't have a 2 month coaching search so it's a bit different when their season is over and coach has left to interview coaches...basically hey who is interested and select some to interview.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 6:12 pm to SportTiger1
Going 9-4 the first 2 years after O then 4-8 and 2-10 tell you he recruited better than O?
Posted on 12/7/16 at 6:15 pm to Topwater Trout
LSU is paying Miles 10mil to sit at home. Why wouldn't Alleva pay up to get tier 1 coach? Not saying Fuente necessarily but offer Herman more than Texas or shoot Jimbo a counter offer.
Posted on 12/7/16 at 6:32 pm to Topwater Trout
quote:
Can you name the big differences?
HC recruits and builds the team, interim inherits it
HC hires asst coaching staff, interim inherits it
HC leaves after getting whacked, interim comes in and injects new energy which often isn't sustainable
Interim coach manages 1 player group, HC is the face of a colossal revenue producing machine and is accountable for offense, defense, special teams, and academics of entire team.
HC is 100% accountable, interim coach has nothing to lose. Had O not gotten the HC gig, keeping him on staff is what every LSU fan wanted and hoped the new coach would do and he'd likely have gotten a raise and an upgrade in title. So it's not the same pressure.
HC determines the identity and brand of the program, interim coach walks into an established brand.
HC dictates scheme of offense and defense and over years recruits players to fit those schemes. Interim walks into the role with all of that intact.
HC is accountable to boosters and top level university administration, interim coach is viewed as interviewing for the job.
HC makes public appearances nonstop, meets with sponsors, boosters, charitable organizations and responsible for a $100M + business. Eddie O had a 7 game interview and a weekly coaches show.
If any player on the entire team has an off the field issue or an academic issue the HC answers for that publicly and determines punishment. Interim coach doesn't deal with this.
The HC manages complexity all day every day and at virtually no time is he "off." The interim coach just has to focus on winning games to get the HC gig.
HC is a CEO in the true sense of the word and the interim coach is a temp who steps in to try to win a few games and hold things together while Alleva works out the deets with Jimbo.
In business, middle managers seldom become great CEO's. In football, interim coaches seldom become great HC's.
A midseason takeover of what someone else built and closing out a season requires a totally different skillset than building and maintaining a program at a high level over time does.
Hope it works out for Coach O and LSU but the odds are against it.
This post was edited on 12/7/16 at 6:43 pm
Posted on 12/7/16 at 7:01 pm to Topwater Trout
i never denied that we gauged interest.
what i am saying is we didn't pursue those that were interested.
we whittled the list down to O without a single face to face meeting.
which means either LSU felt them unworthy or not a single one was actually interested.
i find it extremely difficult to believe that there wasn't a single coach not named Ed Orgeron that was worthy of an interview and interested in having one.
what i am saying is we didn't pursue those that were interested.
we whittled the list down to O without a single face to face meeting.
which means either LSU felt them unworthy or not a single one was actually interested.
i find it extremely difficult to believe that there wasn't a single coach not named Ed Orgeron that was worthy of an interview and interested in having one.
Posted on 12/8/16 at 12:42 am to Topwater Trout
quote:
Going 9-4 the first 2 years after O then 4-8 and 2-10 tell you he recruited better than O?
Recruiting rankings baw. Which is exactly what everyone uses to say O is an elite recruiter...so I'll use it as well.
Plus, by O's 3rd year recruiting his own guys, he should have had elite soph and juniors. Those are the exact guys nutt won 9 games with. O won what, 3 in 2007?
If O was a half way decent coach, with his supposed elite recruiting, he should have made some progress by year 3. He got worse. Its really that simple.
Posted on 12/8/16 at 12:43 am to Rou Leed
quote:
He was unsuccesful 20 years ago
Well now we all know you have no clue what you are talking about, if we didn't already.
Posted on 12/8/16 at 2:37 am to Rou Leed
quote:
He was unsuccesful 20 years ago at a place were nobody has been able to have sustained success at the level of USC, UT, Miami, and LSU (places he experienced success).
I could understand your argument if he only had moderate success at OM, but he flat out fell on his face there. He was worse than the coach before him or after him.
Just as a frame of reference O won more SEC games this year than all 3 years he was at OM. That's really bad, and cause for concern. Hopefully he proves he has learned from his mistakes, but to just automatically dismiss it with weak claims is not gonna make him look any better.
If he pulls this perm HC gig off for a couple years, then that would prove it to me. Until then, it's just a wait, hope, and see approach.
Posted on 12/8/16 at 7:40 am to Topwater Trout
quote:
want all the posters spouting that to answer. I think most of them don't know what the frick they're talking about and being over dramatic
USC went into 2013 ranked #1, LSU came into this season top 3 and the most experienced roster in the nation. Both their stubborn coaches bombed. All O did was inject some energy and change a couple things a blind man would've seen.
Posted on 12/8/16 at 1:46 pm to hashtag
quote:
Technically, that would be Ctrl+H, unless he is stupid, like you.
Now that's just unnecessary
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