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Posted on 3/26/18 at 2:19 pm
Posted on 3/26/18 at 2:19 pm
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This post was edited on 11/5/18 at 5:45 pm
4
Posted on 3/26/18 at 3:51 pm to McLemore
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This post was edited on 11/5/18 at 5:44 pm
Posted on 3/27/18 at 5:37 am to Dfox
Running is a lot about consistency and slowly building up. 10% mileage increase per week is a good rule of thumb. If you are truly a couch potato, maybe start with 1 mile every other day. If you have to walk run, stick with it until you can run a mile each time. then slowly increase the mileage. As you grow to larger goals, you stagger with some shorter runs during the week and long runs on the weekend. But at 5k, you can do that any night of the week and not overly stress your body. It's the marathon distances where you limit yourself to 3-8 miles during the week and a big run on the weekend. Understand rest is needed and understand that every run has a purpose. Never read the Jack Daniels book, but my triathlon coach based his workouts off of it. My vDot is figured out with a test 5k run. My easy pace, marathon, half marathon, and tempo paced are all determined from that vdot test (charts for this are online). Most running is at an easy pace which honestly feels so slow it's annoying. This helps build miles without injury. About 2 runs per week at most go into more specific faster paced workouts. PRd in a half marathon a few weeks back and that is not even remotely the focus of my training, so it works.
Swimming takes technique. There are no shortcuts. You can't just power through bad technique. YouTube helps to be honest. Lots of tips on what the proper stroke is. But it's hard for some people to see what they do wrong since they can't see themselves. Lots of swimming aids are used as a crutch, but I find a pull bouy helpful at first. Put it between your legs and let it help you float right. Allows you to swim very slow to learn key aspects of the stroke and commit them to muscle memory. Rotation, timing of breath, high elbow, early catch and tons of other things are much easier to isolate and improve with a pull bouy. But once you learn, pick that thing up and swim. Many keep using it and never learn to swim with legs high in the water to reduce drag. Takes some core work. On top of that. swimming is another thing where each workout should have meaning. Dont just log yards. I improved greatly when I was given structured workouts. Such as 500 years warm up, 10x100 yard with 15 seconds rest in between (swim hard as you can hold for the whole set), 5 x 200 at moderate pace with 15 seconds rest, 250 cool down. That's a decent sized workout and not necessarily for a beginner. But that built up my speed and conditioning much more than just swimming 2750 yards straight. I'd be swimming slower and with bad technique due to tiring out if I did it straight. Practicing this way let's me work on technique now so that I dont tire out and swim shitty when its needed. Swimming is something that comes I spurts too. I think it took like 4 or 5 weeks for me to be excited about swimming 300 yards straight to being able to swim a mile in one continuous swim (very slow). You get a feel for the water and it opens up your ability a lot. putting in time in the pool doesn't always feel like progress, but you do a time trial or something and realize just how much faster you were than 2 months ago.
I am without a doubt the slowest, least advanced endurance person who nerds out on this stuff sometimes
. So take it for what it's worth. I will admit that if you ever get serious about longer stuff and have some money to burn, there are coaches out there for this stuff. I never realized that. When I decided to do an Ironman I got one. It's not cheap, but instead of having some prepackaged training plan, he caters it to me and will explain what I'm doing. If I miss a workout, instead of following some online calendar that doesn't take that into account, he'll adjust. I have my doubts some times that it's worth it, then I have a big weekend like the past two weekends with the longest run I've ever done followed by 100 mile bike the next day and I'm not even sore (tired, but not sore). He sets my pace and tells me what to do. Huge help, but you are looking at around $150 a month and it's for goals bigger than a 5k. Just mentioning if you ever get to that. I am only doing it for the 6 months leading up to Ironman.
Swimming takes technique. There are no shortcuts. You can't just power through bad technique. YouTube helps to be honest. Lots of tips on what the proper stroke is. But it's hard for some people to see what they do wrong since they can't see themselves. Lots of swimming aids are used as a crutch, but I find a pull bouy helpful at first. Put it between your legs and let it help you float right. Allows you to swim very slow to learn key aspects of the stroke and commit them to muscle memory. Rotation, timing of breath, high elbow, early catch and tons of other things are much easier to isolate and improve with a pull bouy. But once you learn, pick that thing up and swim. Many keep using it and never learn to swim with legs high in the water to reduce drag. Takes some core work. On top of that. swimming is another thing where each workout should have meaning. Dont just log yards. I improved greatly when I was given structured workouts. Such as 500 years warm up, 10x100 yard with 15 seconds rest in between (swim hard as you can hold for the whole set), 5 x 200 at moderate pace with 15 seconds rest, 250 cool down. That's a decent sized workout and not necessarily for a beginner. But that built up my speed and conditioning much more than just swimming 2750 yards straight. I'd be swimming slower and with bad technique due to tiring out if I did it straight. Practicing this way let's me work on technique now so that I dont tire out and swim shitty when its needed. Swimming is something that comes I spurts too. I think it took like 4 or 5 weeks for me to be excited about swimming 300 yards straight to being able to swim a mile in one continuous swim (very slow). You get a feel for the water and it opens up your ability a lot. putting in time in the pool doesn't always feel like progress, but you do a time trial or something and realize just how much faster you were than 2 months ago.
I am without a doubt the slowest, least advanced endurance person who nerds out on this stuff sometimes
. So take it for what it's worth. I will admit that if you ever get serious about longer stuff and have some money to burn, there are coaches out there for this stuff. I never realized that. When I decided to do an Ironman I got one. It's not cheap, but instead of having some prepackaged training plan, he caters it to me and will explain what I'm doing. If I miss a workout, instead of following some online calendar that doesn't take that into account, he'll adjust. I have my doubts some times that it's worth it, then I have a big weekend like the past two weekends with the longest run I've ever done followed by 100 mile bike the next day and I'm not even sore (tired, but not sore). He sets my pace and tells me what to do. Huge help, but you are looking at around $150 a month and it's for goals bigger than a 5k. Just mentioning if you ever get to that. I am only doing it for the 6 months leading up to Ironman. 
Posted on 3/27/18 at 8:11 am to KG6
Good info
I think the thing I struggle with the most in endurance running is slowing down. I just can’t seem to physically bring myself to run a slower pace and sometimes feel worse if I run slower. I have tried to start running with a friend of mine a bit more who is well behind my pace to slow me down.
I think the thing I struggle with the most in endurance running is slowing down. I just can’t seem to physically bring myself to run a slower pace and sometimes feel worse if I run slower. I have tried to start running with a friend of mine a bit more who is well behind my pace to slow me down.
Posted on 3/27/18 at 9:36 am to hogbody
I'm a recently retired long time endurance guy, IM finsher, many many 1/2 IMs, blah blah. Go get a good heart rate monitor/gps watch, like a Garmin. You're wasting time without one.
You need to figure out your max HR for run and bike, and not by some sort of age-based-addition BS. Do some intervals, like puke level intervals, and that will tell you your actual max HR on bike and run.
Then, start slow, like 70% of your max for a few months. Yes, you'll be running say an 11:00 mile at 70%, and biking at 14 mph at 70% when you start. But in a few months, you'll be running 8:00/miles and riding at 19-21 with your HR at 70%.
Biggest mistake people make when starting endurance/triathlons, IN MY HUMBLE OPINION, is not building a solid cardio base. You just can't do a 12-13 hour full IM with your heart pumping at 85% of max HR, you'll run out of gas before you start the run.
It's all about having a solid cardio base, being able to go for miles and hours at 70-75% of max HR. Once you have that, you start on the intervals and sprints to build strength and speed.
ETA: I see you refer only to run and swim, the above still applies, but you can join a master's swim class after a couple months of some long, steady swim sessions. You'll need the cardio base to handle all the intervals in the pool.
You need to figure out your max HR for run and bike, and not by some sort of age-based-addition BS. Do some intervals, like puke level intervals, and that will tell you your actual max HR on bike and run.
Then, start slow, like 70% of your max for a few months. Yes, you'll be running say an 11:00 mile at 70%, and biking at 14 mph at 70% when you start. But in a few months, you'll be running 8:00/miles and riding at 19-21 with your HR at 70%.
Biggest mistake people make when starting endurance/triathlons, IN MY HUMBLE OPINION, is not building a solid cardio base. You just can't do a 12-13 hour full IM with your heart pumping at 85% of max HR, you'll run out of gas before you start the run.
It's all about having a solid cardio base, being able to go for miles and hours at 70-75% of max HR. Once you have that, you start on the intervals and sprints to build strength and speed.
ETA: I see you refer only to run and swim, the above still applies, but you can join a master's swim class after a couple months of some long, steady swim sessions. You'll need the cardio base to handle all the intervals in the pool.
This post was edited on 3/27/18 at 9:39 am
Posted on 3/27/18 at 10:03 am to TheCurmudgeon
quote:
But in a few months, you'll be running 8:00/miles and riding at 19-21 with your HR at 70%.
Not everyone
. My average HR for my last 5k was like 188-190. I can't run a 12 minute pace at 70% of that HR. Hell, I can't run to the toilet without getting my HR above that. HR is a great tool, but it's only one input. It's so variable from person to person that you can't as easily apply it to everyone. I do believe in the vDot method though. It's still variable, but it's been pretty spot on for me. Found my vDot from my 5k time trial, then trained bsed on that. Ran my half marathon based on it's predicted half pace and had one of the best feeling races I've ever had. Felt like I did everything right.
Posted on 3/27/18 at 10:34 pm to Dfox
Find a Masters swim program.
Posted on 3/29/18 at 2:44 pm to Dobermann
Jump Rope
Posted on 3/30/18 at 3:33 pm to Dfox
Slowtwitch.com is a good source for articles or forums. Just go slower than you think you need to and build miles slowly. For swimming work more on technique than distance. Plenty of good information on the site mentioned above.
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