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Message
re: Nintendo Switch Presentation 1/12/17 11 PM ET
Posted on 1/17/17 at 12:41 pm to DieDaily
Posted on 1/17/17 at 12:41 pm to DieDaily
quote:yeah this is where i'm at...$300 hundo is a good price, but the accessory costs are a turn off and I don't even want a pro controller. only accessory I plan on buying is an extra charger so I can keep the one in the dock permanently.
But neither the PS4 nor the XBO are a portable system which carries with it a slew of unique problems such as weight, battery life, ergonomics, durability, etc. I feel like everyone, including the games "journalists", making this direct comparison are overlooking this very obvious fact.
I will, however, agree the the peripheral prices are laughably high. $70 for a pro controller? $90 for an additional dock? A bundle of a left and right joy-con is $80. That's where the pricing makes no sense to me.
1
Posted on 1/17/17 at 2:02 pm to DelU249
Any other places where I can still Pre-Order besides game stop? I put one in there but want somewhere else as backup.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 2:06 pm to LSU Coyote
I don't know. I stayed up all night into Friday morning to preorder. I heard the next day they were going to take in store preorders, but if those are sold out I wouldn't know where.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 2:09 pm to DelU249
I did also but for some reason missed the Amazon preorder. Went to sleep for maybe an hour, got up to check and you guys already ordered. Was like awesome but when I got to the page Pre-Orders were shut down.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 2:24 pm to Freauxzen
Been meaning to respond to this, but didn't have time to give a good effort.
I agree that's not fair to compare all indies to a single publisher, but I think you underestimate their impact. I believe they're directly responsible for the direction that major AAA games take. Resident Evil 7 will be 1st person in response to the popularity of 1st person horror games like Amnesia, Outlast, and PT. Different game modes and types that get put into practice based on those titles.
I think this has more to do with the time between releases than anything else. Mario or Zelda doesn't feel stale despite very little change because it takes 4-5+ years between each entry. How can it feel stale?
I bet that people will be itching for a new Assasin's Creed in a year or so, because it's been a while since they've released one.
My point is largely the same. Even when in contorl of the process, they very rarely do anything special with it. Wii Sports is the shining example of that, but it's hard to say that any Nintendo game really got any real value out of the gamepad. Wasted generation. The only way that Nintendo would fall into the AAA cycle trap is if they wanted to vastly increase the size of their teams to make them capable of releasing games that quickly. It's not in the culture of their company, and that has nothing to do with hardware manufacturing.
quote:
They also have very little impact on the direction of the industry as thy are wholly reliant on technologies/platforms/systems that the market dictates. They dictate almost nothing (outside of an extreme outlier like Minecraft).
I agree that's not fair to compare all indies to a single publisher, but I think you underestimate their impact. I believe they're directly responsible for the direction that major AAA games take. Resident Evil 7 will be 1st person in response to the popularity of 1st person horror games like Amnesia, Outlast, and PT. Different game modes and types that get put into practice based on those titles.
quote:
Agree to disagree, and that's why I used "innovative/unique" as that line is fuzzy. It's hard to say where that comes from, even if 3D Mario has a very distinct formula: 64, Sunshine, and Galaxy 1/2, while adhering to the basics of that formula, feel like completely different games. Same for OoT, Twilight Princess, and Wind Waker. Whereas, I gave up on Call of Duty years ago because it's the same game over and over again. I thought Halo 5 would be different, but it's the same dang game. There's literally nothing new about those titles. That's not to mention sports games or GTA's/Assassin Creeds/Other Open World Games
I think this has more to do with the time between releases than anything else. Mario or Zelda doesn't feel stale despite very little change because it takes 4-5+ years between each entry. How can it feel stale?
I bet that people will be itching for a new Assasin's Creed in a year or so, because it's been a while since they've released one.
quote:
Mojo is probably a better word than magic for sure. I don't think the hardware itself that's unique or allows them to be unique. It's the control of the process that does. It allows them to gamble, to experiment, to play with ideas wholly unconnected to the game and software itself. That's the important part. For comparison sake from above: Controlling the entire development process and hardware is exactly what leads to the differences between 64, Sunshine, and Galaxy 1/2, I feel Nintendo would fall into the same trap as most 3rd parties where Marios would feel far more like Call of Duties, basically the same game over and over again with better resolution and different textures. That would be a travesty for the industry.
My point is largely the same. Even when in contorl of the process, they very rarely do anything special with it. Wii Sports is the shining example of that, but it's hard to say that any Nintendo game really got any real value out of the gamepad. Wasted generation. The only way that Nintendo would fall into the AAA cycle trap is if they wanted to vastly increase the size of their teams to make them capable of releasing games that quickly. It's not in the culture of their company, and that has nothing to do with hardware manufacturing.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 2:42 pm to oauron
quote:
I agree that's not fair to compare all indies to a single publisher, but I think you underestimate their impact. I believe they're directly responsible for the direction that major AAA games take. Resident Evil 7 will be 1st person in response to the popularity of 1st person horror games like Amnesia, Outlast, and PT. Different game modes and types that get put into practice based on those titles.
That's fair. But if JUST Amnesia is released this probably never happens. It's that Amensia is released. Then someone iterates. Then someone else iterates. And so forth. There are lots of indie clones that fail too which try to do the same things, also. Indies can almost experiment for AAAs.
quote:
I think this has more to do with the time between releases than anything else. Mario or Zelda doesn't feel stale despite very little change because it takes 4-5+ years between each entry. How can it feel stale?
Maybe so. But even then, going back to play the 64 Remake right around Galaxy Time, I don't know how, but things did feel different.
quote:
My point is largely the same. Even when in contorl of the process, they very rarely do anything special with it. Wii Sports is the shining example of that, but it's hard to say that any Nintendo game really got any real value out of the gamepad. Wasted generation.
Innovation or Uniqueness doesn't require someone to follow the lead though, it just requires there being something new. Nintendo can be innovative, and it never catch on. You can't tell me that Snipperclips doesn't look, at the very least, innovative?
"Being Special," can just be that one game. And I do think some of that comes from being allowed to play around with everything - hardware, software, method of control, etc. You can't really play around when you don't control everything.
quote:
The only way that Nintendo would fall into the AAA cycle trap is if they wanted to vastly increase the size of their teams to make them capable of releasing games that quickly. It's not in the culture of their company, and that has nothing to do with hardware manufacturing.
Fair point as well.
But I think that trap is much easier to fall into when you only make software, when you're driven to be a "name" in the market, when you can't do anything truly unique, when you can't really experiment outside of more pixel pushing power, etc. And that's why a lot of third parties fall into that trap.
Honestly, that's why I brought up something like Boom Blox earlier. That was an EA game. The poster child company for someone who almost admittedly makes the same games over and over again, it took new hardware for them to think about publishing something different. Put Nintendo out of control, take away the only company willing to wildly experiment, and I at least don't think it's 100% that Nintendo stays the same, that their level of creativity stays the same.
This post was edited on 1/17/17 at 2:49 pm
Posted on 1/17/17 at 3:32 pm to Freauxzen
what is third party support looking like?
Posted on 1/17/17 at 3:36 pm to CBandits82
quote:
what is third party support looking like?
The line is 80 games in development (this number includes first party). I think we've seen about 50. There are currently no current gen, AAA third party ports outside of FIFA (not counting Skyrim) which is not necessarily a port of the Frostbite-based FIFA 2017 and is marekted as "custom," therefore it's most likely a port of FIFA 17 on the X360/PS3, which is just FIFA 16 rehashed. Not a good sign.
So yes, this is a problem. I do think that if the system sells this will work itself out over time, but we'll see.
However, it might be releasing the best RPG schedule of any console, including new games and ports.
This post was edited on 1/17/17 at 3:38 pm
Posted on 1/17/17 at 3:47 pm to Freauxzen
Nintendo needs a third party machine and they need it now.
They have to have at least a little bit of third party support.
They have to get off the Nintendo Island and see the rest of the world.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 3:56 pm to Drewbie
quote:
Uhhhh....
I can get a 500GB Gears of War Xbox One Bundle for $250 new right now. I'm not talking the updated "S" system, the originals, which still have more power than the Switch will.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 3:57 pm to CBandits82
quote:
Nintendo needs a third party machine and they need it now.
They have to have at least a little bit of third party support.
They have to get off the Nintendo Island and see the rest of the world.
Honestly, this play relies on First Party Games selling consoles over the first 8 months - Zelda and Mario with Splatoon and Kart driving sales in between. What you want to do is sell into the Wii U population as much as you can, which is basically the Nintendo console faithful, get a portion of the 50 million 3DS market that don't have a home console, and bring back some Wii customers. Drive third party investment - Then hit core gamers.
Sometime in there you transition development teams from 3DS to Switch and start pumping out games across the board. I think the big players early are going to be indie games. There are some super good games out there that would be perfect for the Switch - Rocket League, Stardew, etc. They have to hold your gamer interest while you spin up third party investment.
Another rumor came out today on NeoGaf Forums which points to a more advanced dock development kit. This is super rumor territory but it was from someone who broke correct Switch news - but what it would do is basically upscale the console experience further -- on par with current gen. If something like this comes to fruition, that will be interesting.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 4:04 pm to Freauxzen
quote:
Rocket League
if this happens, I will buy it the day Rocket League comes out
Posted on 1/17/17 at 4:06 pm to BaddestAndvari
quote:
if this happens, I will buy it the day Rocket League comes out
I think it's the most important indie game not named Minecrat.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 4:06 pm to Freauxzen
quote:
Another rumor came out today on NeoGaf Forums which points to a more advanced dock development kit
This would actually be very interesting. Instead of incremental HW boosts (which has done with every handheld), if they could just release a dock that allows for better performance, that'd be super interesting.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 4:09 pm to oauron
quote:
This would actually be very interesting. Instead of incremental HW boosts (which has done with every handheld), if they could just release a dock that allows for better performance, that'd be super interesting.
I will say this: the thing is "powered" by usb-c: latest news out of usb-c is that it's the first usb port strong enough to do external computing / processing shite that we are talking about. There are rumors about nVidia chips connecting to usb-c to give a dual-GPU laptop ect. coming out recently
So it's very possible... but the questions would be: will they?
Posted on 1/17/17 at 5:01 pm to oauron
quote:
This would actually be very interesting. Instead of incremental HW boosts (which has done with every handheld), if they could just release a dock that allows for better performance, that'd be super interesting.
LINK
quote:
SCD
What he's describing above matches pretty much exactly what we would expect from a "supplementary computing device", or SCD, which Nintendo patented a few years ago. The SCD would be an add-on unit to Switch (let's say a special version of the dock) which has extra computational hardware inside (i.e. a GPU).
In this particular case what we'd be looking at is a dev kit that is designed to provide the functionality of both devices combined (as it's simpler to make than a dev kit with actual detachable parts). Hence why both the Switch SoC and the new GPU are in the same unit, and why there's a screen (same size as Switch's) and why it's so heavy and doesn't include a battery. For the actual SCD, though, it would likely be a dock with the GPU and RAM, but not the Switch's SoC or the screen.
Regarding the specifics of the leak, when I said the dev kit's chip was "pretty much exactly the size of GP106", I wasn't kidding. According to this (which is the best source I could find), the GP106 measures approximately 11.67mm x 17.13mm, which is extremely close both in size and shape to the leaker's claim that it "looks like" 12mm x 18mm. It's worth noting that the die size of GP106 would have been common knowledge when this was posted (so if the leaker is screwing with us they could have found this out), but if they're not screwing with us then it would seem too close to be a co-incidence.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 6:17 pm to EveryonesACoach
quote:True, but the Xbox One's battery life is even worse than the Switch and its built-in display is extremely lacking, some would say non-existent.
I can get a 500GB Gears of War Xbox One Bundle for $250 new right now. I'm not talking the updated "S" system, the originals, which still have more power than the Switch will.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 7:14 pm to DieDaily
And the Xbox 2 that comes out in 2 years will run you twice the cost of a switch and if this last generation is any clue, will also have a thin launch lineup that doesn't have a heavy hitter like Zelda
Posted on 1/17/17 at 8:47 pm to DelU249
So you saying the next XBONE will be $600? Based on what? I don't think so, the docs don't justify that price point.
Posted on 1/17/17 at 8:54 pm to DieDaily
Regardless of that, I am interested to see what happens with the Scorpio and PS4 Pro.
How will developers respond to games? - Make for Scorpio/PS4 Pro and Port Down or make for X1/PS and port up?
How are sales long term for those upgrades overall?
Shat does VR do to the market?
I think there's a ton of volatility that Nintendo can take advantage of. I mean, what happens if the Scorpio flounders, which I think is a big issue for this half gen upgrade approach.
How will developers respond to games? - Make for Scorpio/PS4 Pro and Port Down or make for X1/PS and port up?
How are sales long term for those upgrades overall?
Shat does VR do to the market?
I think there's a ton of volatility that Nintendo can take advantage of. I mean, what happens if the Scorpio flounders, which I think is a big issue for this half gen upgrade approach.
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