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re: Official NBA Finals prediction thread: Lakers vs Celtics
Posted on 5/29/10 at 11:38 pm to BamaFan89
Posted on 5/29/10 at 11:38 pm to BamaFan89
quote:
No I wasn't. You brought up that PP "matched" Kobe in The Finals and said it could happen again so I was asking if he was gonna fake an injury again
So, like I said, you're deflecting the fact that you laughed when it was said that Pierce can match Kobe's production.
Nice try man, you can't trick me into changing the subject since you know you can't find a way out of being wrong on that one.
You must have not watched 2008's Finals, I guess.
2
Posted on 5/29/10 at 11:39 pm to shel311
I know one thing: Kobe & RonRon will have to play alot harder on the defensive end more than they have all playoffs.
Posted on 5/29/10 at 11:41 pm to Colonel Flagg
quote:
Yes we can never forget that unmeasurable subjective quality that his fans bring up to claim him as by far the greatest in the league.
Dude, you can be sarcastic all you want about unmeasurable basketball qualities, but they are qualities that NBA greats, current players, and coaches praise after every big game Kobe plays. It's not imaginary. Sure, it can't be broken down into a statistical category. However, that does not mean it's any less real or noticeable.
Posted on 5/29/10 at 11:43 pm to AlexLSU
I hate LA & I think Kobe is a smug prick. But over the last 2 years, he's gained alot of my respect. There is no doubt now that he's the best in the league right now....period.
Posted on 5/29/10 at 11:43 pm to shel311
quote:
You must have not watched 2008's Finals, I guess.
I did.
quote:
Pierce can match Kobe's production.
Kobe's 07-08 playoff production was 30.1 ppg 5.7 rpg
PP's 07-08 playoff production was 19.7 ppg 5.0 rpg
This post was edited on 5/29/10 at 11:45 pm
Posted on 5/29/10 at 11:46 pm to Suck Out West
quote:
I know one thing: Kobe & RonRon will have to play alot harder on the defensive end more than they have all playoffs.
It'll be a similar effort to the effort they gave in the OKC series. Ron will be fine against Pierce IMO. Paul is elite when it comes to getting separation on jumpshots which makes a player nearly impossible to defend. However, he's unathletic. Ron just can't fall for PP's pumpfakes that lead to foul trouble. Kobe can shutdown Rondo. He'll dare Rondo to shoot and sag in the lane. I seriously doubt he guards Rondo much in this series unless he's just going off on Fish/Brown/Farmar. Kobe guarding Ray will be a challenge simply because of how much running Ray does off screens to get open for 3's. They are easily two of the most well conditioned athletes in the league though, so it'll be fun to watch.
Posted on 5/29/10 at 11:50 pm to AlexLSU
quote:
Dude, you can be sarcastic all you want about unmeasurable basketball qualities, but they are qualities that NBA greats, current players, and coaches praise after every big game Kobe plays. It's not imaginary. Sure, it can't be broken down into a statistical category. However, that does not mean it's any less real or noticeable
They're the best players in the world, top players of all time, of course they're gonna perform better when the game is on the line, lol.
Sports cliches, I hate them with a passion.
Posted on 5/29/10 at 11:51 pm to BamaFan89
quote:
You must have not watched 2008's Finals, I guess.
quote:
Kobe's 07-08 playoff production was 30.1 ppg 5.7 rpg
PP's 07-08 playoff production was 19.7 ppg 5.0 rpg
Dude, just stop, you're making it look worse now.
Posted on 5/29/10 at 11:51 pm to AlexLSU
quote:
It'll be a similar effort to the effort they gave in the OKC series.
They're not going against OKC. They're going against a team with at least 2 Hall of Famers with plenty of muscle underneath. You can bet your arse that Kobe will have to play Rondo. I just don't see the Laker PGs staying in front of that guy right now. I think this will be much more competative than 2 years ago. Each basket will be precious. A possible classic.
Posted on 5/29/10 at 11:52 pm to shel311
quote:
Dude, just stop, you're making it look worse now.
Sorry I couldn't find Finals stats on nba.com but if you can find them go ahead
Posted on 5/29/10 at 11:56 pm to BamaFan89
quote:
Sorry I couldn't find Finals stats on nba.com but if you can find them go ahead
Kobe
25.7 ppg
40.5% shooting
5 assists
4.7 rebounds
Also shot 6 of 19, 8 of 21, and 7 of 22 in the last 3 games.
Pierce
21.8 ppg
43.2 % shooting
6.3 assists
4.5 rebounds
Now, if you don't think that's matching Kobe's production, then prayers sent.
Posted on 5/30/10 at 12:00 am to Champs
Lake show in 6
Posted on 5/30/10 at 12:01 am to Champs
Cetlics in 6. I want L.A. to win though.
Posted on 5/30/10 at 12:01 am to shel311
Good stats. 
From just watching it seemed more in Kobe's favor but as you pointed out the last few games when he was trying to do everything by himself his production fell drastically. It will be a good series but I still believe the Lakers win in 6
From just watching it seemed more in Kobe's favor but as you pointed out the last few games when he was trying to do everything by himself his production fell drastically. It will be a good series but I still believe the Lakers win in 6
Posted on 5/30/10 at 12:02 am to shel311
quote:
They're the best players in the world, top players of all time, of course they're gonna perform better when the game is on the line, lol.
Sports cliches, I hate them with a passion.
But to ignore them like Flagg is doing is foolish. Sure saying "killer instinct" or "motor is always running" can get old quick, but both cliches are things that people who watch the game closely pick up on. You can't measure hustle, hardwork, intelligence, etc. always, and those qualities can be the difference in a great player winning or losing certain games.
This series was epic because both teams best player possessed those type of qualities that don't always show up on a statsheet. That's why NBA players and coaches, past and present, love to praise Nash and Kobe. You notice and grow to appreciate the things these guys do that comes from their competitiveness.
Posted on 5/30/10 at 12:04 am to AlexLSU
quote:
You can't measure hustle, hardwork, intelligence, etc. always, and those qualities can be the difference in a great player winning or losing certain games
I definitely agree with THESE qualities.
quote:
"killer instinct" or "motor is always running
It's these qualities, among others, that irk me.
Posted on 5/30/10 at 12:06 am to BamaFan89
2008 NBA Finals
Pierce
22 ppg
5 rpg
6 apg
0.432 FG%
0.393 3PT%
0.830 FT%
Bryant
26 ppg
5 rpg
5 apg
0.405 FG%
0.321 3PT%
0.796 FT%
I would definitely say Pierce countered Bryant pretty well. I feel he just needs to come close as Allen, Garnett, and Rondo can bring amazing performances themselves.
Also got to cheer for Big Baby getting his second ring.
LINK
Pierce
22 ppg
5 rpg
6 apg
0.432 FG%
0.393 3PT%
0.830 FT%
Bryant
26 ppg
5 rpg
5 apg
0.405 FG%
0.321 3PT%
0.796 FT%
I would definitely say Pierce countered Bryant pretty well. I feel he just needs to come close as Allen, Garnett, and Rondo can bring amazing performances themselves.
Also got to cheer for Big Baby getting his second ring.
LINK
This post was edited on 5/30/10 at 12:07 am
Posted on 5/30/10 at 12:10 am to AlexLSU
quote:
But to ignore them like Flagg is doing is foolish. Sure saying "killer instinct" or "motor is always running" can get old quick, but both cliches are things that people who watch the game closely pick up on. You can't measure hustle, hardwork, intelligence, etc. always, and those qualities can be the difference in a great player winning or losing certain games.
I am not trying to ignore him, but Kobe fans say Lebron doesn't have any of these qualities. Then they constantly point to the championships as that proves it when Kobe has had help and Lebron has not. This isn't even bringing up the fact Mike Brown is nothing compared to Phil Jackson as a coach.
Everything Kobe does will always look far better than the other superstars as long as he has one of the better teams around him.
The Celtics match up will be interesting as they have star power most other teams do not.
This post was edited on 5/30/10 at 12:13 am
Posted on 5/30/10 at 12:31 am to Colonel Flagg
First to your previous post about Pierce and Kobe, Pierce got the best of Kobe in the 2008 Finals. Kobe may have been statistically better, but Pierce pretty much shut Kobe down on offense. That's why he deserved MVP of the Finals, because his defense was fantastic.
I don't like the championship arguments except when comparing the truly elite at the end of their careers. Championships are fine to compare guys like Magic and Bird. Championships are not fine to compare guys like Dilfer and Marino. I'm well aware that Kobe has more talent on his team than LeBron, but at the same time, pro LeBron people shove statlines down the Kobe crowd's throat as a counter or instigating argument. Similar to the championship argument, that's an unfair one as well. If you take Kobe out of a true system offense that he's played in his entire career, he'd be a career 30ppg scorer. He doesn't get the benefit of isolation plays like LeBron, or pick and roll plays like Nash/Stoudemire. That's basketball that boosts stats, but also basketball that can frick you over come playoff time when one guy hits a slump. I do think that people have greatly underrated LeBron's team now, too. They finished with the best record two straight years for a reason, so it's not like they are COMPLETELY incompetent as a team. LeBron is a great player who does catch a lot of unwarranted hate on here. Same with Kobe. I do not like LeBron's persona at all, but I've come to respect him after the improvement I've noticed in his defense and 3pt shooting. I've come to a point where I just enjoy watching both Kobe and LeBron play, because these are guys you will be able to talk about with your friends and family for decades to come.
My main knock on LeBron is that he just doesn't seem to care at times. While his attitude is loose and funny, it doesn't make him a better player. There are games where he just toys with teams and doesn't give it his all. He doesn't work hard enough on parts of his game that could make him an all-time great player. Where's the post game? He's got all the tools and size to be a dominant low post scorer, but he relies on his size and speed to score in the paint. That won't be there forever, and when his athleticism declines like Kobe's has, what will LeBron use to stay elite?
quote:
I am not trying to ignore him, but Kobe fans say Lebron doesn't have any of these qualities. Then they constantly point to the championships as that proves it when Kobe has had help and Lebron has not. This isn't even bringing up the fact Mike Brown is nothing compared to Phil Jackson as a coach
I don't like the championship arguments except when comparing the truly elite at the end of their careers. Championships are fine to compare guys like Magic and Bird. Championships are not fine to compare guys like Dilfer and Marino. I'm well aware that Kobe has more talent on his team than LeBron, but at the same time, pro LeBron people shove statlines down the Kobe crowd's throat as a counter or instigating argument. Similar to the championship argument, that's an unfair one as well. If you take Kobe out of a true system offense that he's played in his entire career, he'd be a career 30ppg scorer. He doesn't get the benefit of isolation plays like LeBron, or pick and roll plays like Nash/Stoudemire. That's basketball that boosts stats, but also basketball that can frick you over come playoff time when one guy hits a slump. I do think that people have greatly underrated LeBron's team now, too. They finished with the best record two straight years for a reason, so it's not like they are COMPLETELY incompetent as a team. LeBron is a great player who does catch a lot of unwarranted hate on here. Same with Kobe. I do not like LeBron's persona at all, but I've come to respect him after the improvement I've noticed in his defense and 3pt shooting. I've come to a point where I just enjoy watching both Kobe and LeBron play, because these are guys you will be able to talk about with your friends and family for decades to come.
My main knock on LeBron is that he just doesn't seem to care at times. While his attitude is loose and funny, it doesn't make him a better player. There are games where he just toys with teams and doesn't give it his all. He doesn't work hard enough on parts of his game that could make him an all-time great player. Where's the post game? He's got all the tools and size to be a dominant low post scorer, but he relies on his size and speed to score in the paint. That won't be there forever, and when his athleticism declines like Kobe's has, what will LeBron use to stay elite?
Posted on 5/30/10 at 12:34 am to AlexLSU
Okay that was a long post.
Cliffnotes:
1. Kobe rulz
2. frick everyone else!!!!!
Cliffnotes:
1. Kobe rulz
2. frick everyone else!!!!!
This post was edited on 5/30/10 at 12:35 am
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