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2
Posted on 10/29/23 at 6:55 pm to shel311
quote:
He was factually below league average scoring efficiency last season.
As judged by what? TS%?
Posted on 10/29/23 at 6:59 pm to TotesMcGotes
Hes right RJ is at 18.3 and BI around 16 but at the same time theres nobody in their right mind thinks RJ is a better scorer and heck even a more efficient scorer than BI.
This post was edited on 10/29/23 at 7:00 pm
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:01 pm to Pels_Yaz
According to whom?
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:03 pm to TotesMcGotes
StatMuse
Also to add:
RJ EFG% 52.9
TS % 58.1
BI EFG% 52.9
TS % 57.1
To add to this, BI is the only player besides Kira that’s played any sort of impactful minutes this season and has a negative net rating. We have a -1.3 NTR with Ingram on the floor, and a +21.3 off the floor. Those numbers would improve with better shooting efficiency from him.
Also to add:
RJ EFG% 52.9
TS % 58.1
BI EFG% 52.9
TS % 57.1
To add to this, BI is the only player besides Kira that’s played any sort of impactful minutes this season and has a negative net rating. We have a -1.3 NTR with Ingram on the floor, and a +21.3 off the floor. Those numbers would improve with better shooting efficiency from him.
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:03 pm to TotesMcGotes
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:03 pm to cgrand
quote:BI is more efficient than Kobe actually but you have to adjust for the era.
Kobe Bryant was an extremely inefficient player. He was balanced by one of the most efficient players in nba history and they won plenty
Looking at the 2 Kobe championship years where he was the #1 dude, league average TS% was around .540 and Kobe was over .570 in both seasons, so a decent bit above average.
Just because Zion is super efficient, I still don't think you can be your absolute most successful if your 2nd best dude who is a volume shooter isn't efficient.
The funny thing for me is most people point to more 3s, which I do agree with. But I think equally as critical is I want him to take more shots at the rim. He's so good at that, and he just doesn't do it. The thing is, he can get the contested middie any time he wants, so imo he should try to get easier looks then take that middie late in the shot clock as it is a fantastic option to give him the ball and let him cook when things break down on a possession.
With the Lakers 33% of his shots came at the rim. Year 1 with the Pels it was 24%. Then the last 3 seasons have all been at 14%. That's wild to go from 33% of your shots at the rim to 14%. It's arguably a bigger issue than the 3s.
And for a super small sample size, that number is below 6% for the 1st 2 games.
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:04 pm to PrayingMantis
[quote]Ingram was the bud driver after Zion went down. Especially with a hurt CJ. That means he was taking all the low shot clock and more difficult shots which drops efficiency.
Absolutely. It’s why numbers without context are usually misleading.
Absolutely. It’s why numbers without context are usually misleading.
This post was edited on 10/29/23 at 7:05 pm
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:05 pm to PrayingMantis
Nobody is denying Ingram can shoot the shite out of the midrange shot, the problem is that is a VERY inefficient shot in today’s NBA, especially when you’re passing up wide open 3’s to take two dribbles inside and shoot it.
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:05 pm to PrayingMantis
quote:All the best dudes in the league do that. He's on the very low end of scoring efficiency if you look at the top 25-30 dudes in the league or wherever you'd slot him.
Ingram was the bud driver after Zion went down. Especially with a hurt CJ. That means he was taking all the low shot clock and more difficult shots which drops efficiency
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:06 pm to Pels_Yaz
Motherfricker I’m aware of what PER is.
I’m unaware of where Barrett is listed as higher than BI.
I’m unaware of where Barrett is listed as higher than BI.
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:06 pm to Soggymoss
quote:
Nobody is denying Ingram can shoot the shite out of the midrange shot,
But you are arguing to do something you’re not as good at more and do something you’re very good at less.
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:07 pm to TotesMcGotes
Im not trying to piss you off- although I tend to do that lol
Its on the link I sent. You can look up RJ as well its higher.
Its on the link I sent. You can look up RJ as well its higher.
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:08 pm to TotesMcGotes
quote:Correct, that's the best judge of that.
As judged by what? TS%?
And then you go a step further and compare him to like players, like the top 30 or so, and he doesn't compare very well.
It definitely calls into question, is he top 30 or is it more like top 50 or so when you consider he's not a great defender.
BI is fantastic. I'd argue though that he needs to be judged on this higher standard. He's on a max deal but most importantly, he's shooting on volumes like the best dudes, so that's who you have to compare him to.
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:08 pm to Soggymoss
quote:
To add to this, BI is the only player besides Kira that’s played any sort of impactful minutes this season and has a negative net rating. We have a -1.3 NTR with Ingram on the floor, and a +21.3 off the floor. Those numbers would improve with better shooting efficiency from him.
Using 2023-2024 stats after 2 games is silly.
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:08 pm to Soggymoss
quote:
To add to this, BI is the only player besides Kira that’s played any sort of impactful minutes this season and has a negative net rating
You do realize Bi has been the one on the court with the Kira, Dyson, Larry and Ryan lineup? Again numbers without context and using common sense don’t tell you much.
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:10 pm to LSUgrad88
quote:That's why you compare him to other volume scorers who do the same thing taking similar tough shots in tough spots.
Absolutely. It’s why numbers without context are usually misleading.
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:11 pm to shel311
more free throws would drastically improve ingrams overall impact on game score. That’s more likely for him to be successful at then all of a sudden launching 3 pointers
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:11 pm to LSUgrad88
quote:
But you are arguing to do something you’re not as good at more and do something you’re very good at less.
Again, run the numbers (using last season), BI shoots the midrange at around 44%, he shoots the 3 at 39%.
That means for every 100 midrange shots he takes he scores 88 points, for every 100 3 point shots he takes he scores 117 points, 29 points more. He takes at least 8 midranges a game, if just half of those were 3 point shots along with his regular 3 a game then he would be averaging around 5 more ppg, and be more efficient while opening up more space in the paint for Zion/JV to work.
And as i stated earlier, he doesn’t even have to take bad 3’s to get to that number, the defense gives him wide open 3’s all the time because they know his tendency is to dribble inside and take a midrange instead of a wide open 3.
This post was edited on 10/29/23 at 7:14 pm
Posted on 10/29/23 at 7:12 pm to LSUgrad88
quote:Because the thing he's less good at is still more efficient than the Midrange shot.
But you are arguing to do something you’re not as good at more and do something you’re very good at less.
Also, he IS good at the other efficiently shots, 3s and shots at the rim. He's good at both, so I don't really get why we would not all be in agreement on this one.
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