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Message
re: Do people realize the fuel for EVs is Petroleum?
Posted on 9/2/24 at 10:20 am to Volvagia
Posted on 9/2/24 at 10:20 am to Volvagia
quote:
By that argument, all cars fail about the same rate because 100k miles is a common warranty threshold.
Lexus told me my GX would only go 6 years or 70000 if that’s true.
I’d say that this would be a solid argument for me to my wife to convince her that since I’m at 95k it’s time for that braptor or GX550, but even she knows it’s an asinine argument.
This post was edited on 9/2/24 at 11:20 pm
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Posted on 9/2/24 at 11:10 am to LSU4lyfe
quote:
Studies have shown that it takes a Toyota Camry 88,000 miles of emissions to equal the emissions out of by just making car batteries.
I disagree with what i think you meant, but I can’t be sure what that was because your sentence is gibberish.
You didn’t specify how many car batteries, or if these are full EV batteries or just the starting batteries for an ICE vehicle. Do these studies include the emissions from manufacturing the ICE vehicle? In short, it’s a bunch of nonsense.
Posted on 9/2/24 at 11:18 am to Reubaltaich
quote:
500,000 pounds
This is a little sensational, why not convert it to ounces and make it sound even more impressive. This is about the size of a big residential swimming pool.
Nickel, cobalt, lithium and copper are mined for many other things, and the end product doesn’t make it anymore or less efficient to mine for it.
Once these metals are mined they are 95% recyclable.
The same amount of soil would only yielded 6 oz of gold. Gold is found in concentrations of .004 ppm where lithium is .20 ppm, and nickel .75 ppm.
This post was edited on 9/2/24 at 11:21 am
Posted on 9/2/24 at 11:21 am to Rust Cohle
quote:
Once these metals are mined they are 95% recyclable.
Car engines are made from metals that are 100% recyclable.
Posted on 9/2/24 at 11:26 am to Rust Cohle
quote:
Samsung will start producing a solid-state battery in 27 with a range of 600 miles and a charge time of nine minutes.
Some people believe everything they read on the internet...
Try to imagine a charging station that has the capacity to charge a 100 kWh battery in "just minutes".
Posted on 9/2/24 at 11:27 am to Volvagia
quote:
By that argument, all cars fail about the same rate because 100k miles is a common warranty threshold.
Those are package warranties that cover hundreds or thousands of parts and only represent confidence is the weakest links.
The battery warranty is specifically for batteries.
Also, a single part on an ICE vehicle breaking will not require the same amount of power/C02 release as replacing EV batteries.
Posted on 9/2/24 at 11:30 am to Saunson69
This argument is beaten to death.
Have the hardline anti-EV people considered that some consumers simply want an EV? Maybe not for environmental reasons. Maybe they want instant torque or don’t want to waste time at gas stations.
The point is, I can’t understand why so many of you are triggered and offended by consumer choice.
Have the hardline anti-EV people considered that some consumers simply want an EV? Maybe not for environmental reasons. Maybe they want instant torque or don’t want to waste time at gas stations.
The point is, I can’t understand why so many of you are triggered and offended by consumer choice.
Posted on 9/2/24 at 11:34 am to Azkiger
quote:
Those are package warranties that cover hundreds or thousands of parts and only represent confidence is the weakest links.
Warranties are financial liabilities that have more input from accountants than engineers. Typically the engineering teams senses over the failure curves from the HALT then a bunch of accountants figure out the warranty. Using it to infer reliability or mean time to failure is a fools errand.
This post was edited on 9/2/24 at 11:35 am
Posted on 9/2/24 at 11:46 am to jimmy the leg
quote:
We need more, not less.
I can't imagine being so wrapped up in propaganda that someone would actually think this way, but alas here we are
Posted on 9/2/24 at 12:07 pm to billjamin
quote:
Warranties are financial liabilities that have more input from accountants than engineers.
Citation needed.
Posted on 9/2/24 at 1:17 pm to Rust Cohle
quote:
Samsung will start producing a solid-state battery in 27 with a range of 600 miles and a charge time of nine minutes.
When? Never mind, it doesn't matter - do the math:
A 600 mile range infers a battery with ~ 2x the capacity of current EVs (no, they won't make it up in efficiency, batteries and motors are already very efficient, not much to gain there).
So that's ~ 200kWh capacity. The newest V3 Tesla Supercharger is limited to 250kW. The battery can't accept full current at the low/high ends, and charging isn't 100% efficient (and the faster you charge, the less efficient it is), so it would take at least an hour to charge, probably more.
OK, bigger chargers? Well nine minutes is 0.15 of an hour. And to charge a 200 kWh battery in an hour @ the 480 VDC charging voltage would be 417 AMPS (and even at this, the V3 uses liquid cooled charge cables). So to do it in 0.15 of an hour means... 2,778 AMPS!!!!! Add in significant losses at those currents, and the lower charge rates at high/low end (which means higher peak current to average the above number), and it's just not a realistic number. And at what cost? I know, details.
The still-in-development MEGA-CHARGER-CONNECTOR is being planned for a max 3,000 Amps - so that probably could not even handle the peak currents needed.
LINK
edited- mixed up Charger 250kW capacity and battery 200kWh capacity - corrected
This post was edited on 9/2/24 at 1:28 pm
Posted on 9/2/24 at 1:20 pm to TCO
quote:
The point is, I can’t understand why so many of you are triggered and offended by consumer choice.
Because too many of the EV owners made their choice using our money (tax dollars).
If you want one, buy one, I'll be happy for you. But don't preach to me about the environment (as some, not all do), and do it with your own money.
Posted on 9/2/24 at 1:27 pm to MidWestGuy
The tax credit isn't that much and most people aren't preaching about the environment. Take Californians out of the equation and you'll find this out. EVs are fun to drive and make sense for certain lifestyles. It's like me making fun of you for needing a truck for your lifestyle. I don't need to pull shite but omfg you have to why would you live that way!? That is how these folks sound
Posted on 9/2/24 at 1:35 pm to jmarto1
quote:
The tax credit isn't that much ...
OK, get rid of it.
quote:
... most people aren't preaching about the environment. ..
I said "some, not all". Whether it is "most" (over half?) or not, is debatable.
quote:
.... EVs are fun to drive and make sense for certain lifestyles. It's like me making fun of you for needing a truck for your lifestyle. I don't need to pull shite but omfg you have to why would you live that way!? That is how these folks sound
Except, I didn't make fun of any EV owners, I said "If you want one, buy one, I'll be happy for you. ". And I don't own/drive a truck (not that there's anything wrong with that either). So stop projecting :)
This post was edited on 9/2/24 at 1:36 pm
Posted on 9/2/24 at 1:36 pm to MidWestGuy
quote:
OK, get rid of it.
Talk to your elected officials
Posted on 9/2/24 at 1:41 pm to MidWestGuy
quote:
Because too many of the EV owners made their choice using our money (tax dollars).
LINK
quote:
As we’ll hear today, the United States subsidizes the fossil fuel industry with taxpayer dollars. It’s not just the US: according to the International Energy Agency, fossil fuel handouts hit a global high of $1 trillion in 2022 – the same year Big Oil pulled in a record $4 trillion of income.
In the United States, by some estimates taxpayers pay about $20 billion dollars every year to the fossil fuel industry. What do we get for that? Economists generally agree: not much. To quote conservative economist Gib Metcalf: these subsidies offer “little if any benefit in the form of oil patch jobs, lower prices at the pump, or increased energy security for the country.” The cash subsidy is both big and wrong.
Posted on 9/2/24 at 1:44 pm to Azkiger
quote:
Citation needed.
I can’t cite independent engineers reports with the MTTF curves and financial model in them. They’re confidential. But you can pull up some business text books that discuss warranties and tell me how much you find in engineering text vs accounting texts. That should point you in the right direction.
Posted on 9/2/24 at 1:46 pm to MidWestGuy
quote:
OK, get rid of it.
Plenty of EV buyers don’t even qualify for it. I didn’t for my wife’s car. But arguing to remove one of the few consumer facing rebates is laughable when you take a look at how much corporate subsidization happens in other industries. Someone getting to keep some of their own tax money isn’t the enemy.
Posted on 9/2/24 at 1:46 pm to billjamin
quote:
But you can pull up some business text books that discuss warranties and tell me how much you find in engineering text vs accounting texts.
OK. I'll get right on doing the leg work to prove your argument right.
Posted on 9/2/24 at 1:47 pm to Azkiger
quote:
OK. I'll get right on doing the leg work to prove your argument right.
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