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Message
1
Posted on 8/31/24 at 6:21 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:Evidence. You have a real problem accepting facts.
You mean "given my personal framing" contradicts your statement.
The human life cycle has a clear process that is followed. Without exception. Whether by natural process or IVF every single one begins the same way.
Posted on 8/31/24 at 6:23 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
That statement has nothing to do with morality
It's pure rhetoric/logic and discussing rhetorical and logical techniques
Here's some logic smart Boi
LINK
Posted on 8/31/24 at 6:26 pm to llfshoals
quote:
You have a real problem accepting facts.
You permit leftists to just frame it however they want up to birth.
I doubt you'd accept that, no matter how many times they called their stage facts and your stance emotional.
quote:
The human life cycle has a clear process that is followed. Without exception. Whether by natural process or IVF every single one begins the same way.
Again no one is debating this. The issue is when the cells become a sentient human
Posted on 8/31/24 at 6:27 pm to SlowFlowPro
Men should not have casual sex, but they do.
Posted on 8/31/24 at 6:27 pm to madamtiger
quote:
I got married when he was three
So you did get bailed out, congrats
Posted on 8/31/24 at 6:41 pm to zeebo
quote:
Men should not have casual sex, but they do.
Sure, but I don't think that should be illegal either, even if I found it immoral.
Posted on 8/31/24 at 6:42 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Sure, but I don't think that should be illegal either, even if I found it immoral.
So what is the objective truth? And why shouldn't we follow that?
Posted on 8/31/24 at 6:44 pm to scottydoesntknow
quote:
So you did get bailed out, congrats
You’re a dick - I hope your PlayStation breaks and your mom won’t drive you to Best Buy to get a new one on her credit card.
Posted on 8/31/24 at 6:44 pm to gaetti15
quote:
So what is the objective truth?
Philosophers and religious figures have been asking that question for 12,000 years
quote:
And why shouldn't we follow that?
The question that hasn't been answered in the literal history of human society may not be the best way to craft your civilization. You may have people who disagree with you just as sincerely and we will call them Muslims for the purposes of this conversation
This post was edited on 8/31/24 at 6:46 pm
Posted on 8/31/24 at 6:47 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Philosophers and religious figures have been asking that question for 12,000 years
Cool so just go with what the majority says it right?
Or just the individual?
Society?
Posted on 8/31/24 at 6:48 pm to themunch
There are extreme cases......and they should aways be considered.
Posted on 8/31/24 at 7:08 pm to gaetti15
quote:
Cool so just go with what the majority says it right?
Are you discussing personal morality or political policy preferences?
Posted on 8/31/24 at 7:24 pm to gaetti15
quote:
Love it Foo...even though we may differ on the Pope among other things!
Posted on 8/31/24 at 7:27 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Are you discussing personal morality or political policy preferences?
Are these two not intertwined? Do we not, or are we not supposed to, let our personal moral beliefs guide our political policy preferences?
Posted on 8/31/24 at 7:28 pm to llfshoals
quote:
If it’s not why did you use the term?
...
I never said the term couldn't be used, I made a comment on how to use it properly.
quote:
Neither the sperm or the egg meet the definition of living organism. The zygote does.
So, the phrase "human sperm" has an internal definitional conflict?
Stop.
I answered your question properly. The species the zygote belongs to is the same species the sperm and egg cell that created it is from. That's not the same thing as saying a sperm or egg cell is it's own organism.
quote:
No way to know until we die and find out if entropy or heaven/hell is our fate.
Or a near infinite amount of other possible outcomes.
Posted on 8/31/24 at 7:33 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:Millions disagreed about the immorality of human chattel slavery in America, too. As I've consistently said, consensus doesn't determine truth.
And many (as in millions) disagree.
quote:Just because you pretend that truth doesn't exist doesn't mean it doesn't. You seem to enjoy playing the contrarian but lives are at stake in this discussion; it's not some game or intellectual exercise.
You're allowed to, legally, of course. However I take the opposite approach because I do not think we know and as proof I offer the incredibly divergent opinions.
quote:Ironically, "viability" is an arbitrary position, not one that is fact/logic-based. While you can apply logic and facts to arguments after assuming the standard of viability, there is no logical or factual basis for choosing viability as your standard to begin with.
Even viability, which is what I would be closet to adopting personally, is changing, as our medical application improves and we can make fetuses viable at earlier and earlier stages in the process. Unless science stops, even that standard will be changing, so even an inflexible, fact/logic-based opinion of viability changes over time.
You've started with an arbitrary standard and then acknowledge that the standard can and does change. Perhaps you should consider another standard that does not change over time (conception).
quote:Seems like you're jus engaging for the fun of it, then.
But this is all personal-moral stances on the issue.
None of this applies to preferred political policies.
Posted on 8/31/24 at 7:33 pm to MemphisGuy
quote:
let our personal moral beliefs guide our political policy preferences?
Because the majority is grey in their moral beliefs internally and externally, every decision is one of convenience. What benefits ME more at a given time and moment
This post was edited on 8/31/24 at 7:34 pm
Posted on 8/31/24 at 7:41 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
And you're free to hold this view, but I don't think many will agree, which illustrates my point about the importance of separating personal-moral stances and political-policy stances, and how you can believe something is immoral without also mandating pollical-policies making that immorality illegal.
I don't think there is an absolute separation. Politics has as its aim the good of the community. Ethics (or morality) has as its aim the good of man. The good of the community (of men) is sought in reference to the good of man. All things political are therefore ethical (dealing with good of man), but not all things ethical are political. So your opponents' position is that abortion should be outlawed because its abolition is better for the community than the alternative positions.
Now, as you have pointed out, simply saying something is "immoral" does not show that something should be illegal, as there are certain actions or inactions that are ethical but not necessarily political.
Posted on 8/31/24 at 8:40 pm to Warrior Court
quote:
where does your God live? is he just "out there" and you know he exists? this comes from fear of the unknown and generally less intelligent people fall for it time after time.
You do you my brother.
You just better hope that there is no God. It might be a little uncomfortable for you one day if there is.
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