- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: What more needs to be determined Re: "legality" of Trump storing documents?
Posted on 8/26/22 at 2:33 pm to Purplehaze
Posted on 8/26/22 at 2:33 pm to Purplehaze
quote:
Trump had no business taking these documents
The law d disagrees with you.
quote:
There is testimony saying that Trump personally went through so the excuse that he did not know what was being sent to him will not fly.
Except the argument that Trump declassified them will fly.
quote:
The statute involved is a beefed up version that Trump signed into law.
And Trump didn't break it.
1
Posted on 8/26/22 at 2:34 pm to chRxis
No insult meant whatsoever, but IMO you should stay away from the technical nuance of these matters of law/jurisprudence, reserving that deep dive for the legally trained, and instead stick to that level of opinion and conclusion with Rx. And if you ever notice me weighing in with that type and level commentary on Rx, please ring me up. Sounds like a good guideline for everyone, not just this instance specifically.
This post was edited on 8/26/22 at 2:39 pm
Posted on 8/26/22 at 2:38 pm to chRxis
quote:
happened... don't think they'd have signed off on a raid of the FPOTUS if the witness wasn't reliable...
Except they knew they couldn't prove a crime.
Therefore the raid wasn't valid. Even if everything turned up the way they wanted it to, there was no way they could prove a law was broken.
quote:
they may not have been accurate about the specific location (and now we know why, as the records were kept in multiple locations at MAL, per the affidavit), but they weren't wrong about the substance...
Actually they were. Just because the box says top secret, if Trump says that box over there, the one that says to secret isn't classified anymore, it isn't classified.
So yeah, everything was wrong.
Even if they proved he had a box that said super to secret, and he left it at the dinner table at the restaurant, if he said yeah but that document was declassified by me and poof, no longer breaking the law.
And they knew this.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 2:42 pm to chRxis
quote:
, he has the ability... however, typically valid declassification actions require procedures, records, and logging... that doesn't seem to have happened in this case.
What is usual and what is law are different things.
Crap, can't really edit. Just suffice it to say everything else you said is incorrect.
I get it. You were ignorant and listened to CNN.
You thought the president couldn't wave a wand and declassified something.
He doesn't even need a wand to do that.
I get that you bought in hook, line and sinker because you don't know the law.
Everything they say has an ounce of truth in a pound of lies and they only retort the ounce of truth.
You were wrong. Just admit it and move on. I have admitted I was wrong on multiple occasions.
It helps with people believing you. Standing on reasoning you know now are false just hurts your veracity later.
You are going to March back almost everything you said there just like you already took back the whole wand thing.
You now know the facts.
This post was edited on 8/26/22 at 2:52 pm
Posted on 8/26/22 at 2:51 pm to thetempleowl
quote:
Sorry bro, but you don't understand the law. I understand this because who knows the law of top secret documents.
then, we'll apparently agree to disagree... and their evidence to support the probable cause was the signed letter from the lawyer in June saying there was no classified documents at MAL...
Posted on 8/26/22 at 2:52 pm to chRxis
quote:
you also don't have a lawyer saying they didn't sign it... interesting, as you'd think FOR SURE they'd contest that fact...
Guilty until proven innocent. Clown world. Posted on 8/26/22 at 2:53 pm to chRxis
quote:
typically valid declassification actions require procedures, records, and logging.
Several federal district judges disagree with you. It’s pretty established and settled law. I understand you weren’t aware of that. No biggie.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 4:46 pm to chRxis
quote:
then, we'll apparently agree to disagree..
Got it. You are one of those people who believe in your truth.
We happen to follow the laws of the United States, not what you think is right.
Though I will grant you many laws are stupid and some of your laws may make more sense.
quote:
and their evidence to support the probable cause was the signed letter from the lawyer in June saying there was no classified documents at MAL...
And there is literally no way the government can prove anything other than this.
You yourself agree that the president can declassified any document.
There is no way the fbi can prove these documents were not declassified.
They know this. We know this. You know this. If trump said he declassified them, well then that is kind of the way it goes.
So, just because someone saw a document that said super top secret, Trump can claim he declassified the document and the government can't do anything about it.
That is why there has never been a raid on a former Presidents home for this stuff before.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 4:58 pm to thetempleowl
Plus the contents, intent and context of the supposed letter have been bastardized and fictionalized. Have we even put our own eyes of said letter, or is it only available through second or third hand portrayal by our esteemed mainstream media? Do we really have anything credible to rely upon in this regard??
This post was edited on 8/26/22 at 5:00 pm
Posted on 8/26/22 at 5:00 pm to Y.A. Tittle
They need this to extend until November 2024.
Posted on 8/26/22 at 6:14 pm to chRxis
quote:
quote:
trample the constitution, so be it.
to be honest, I very much support what Jefferson said, in respect to the Constitution, that it shouldn't be sacred writ... “Some men look at constitutions with sanctimonious reverence and deem them like the ark of the covenant, too sacred to be touched."
There you are...you're good with trampling the constitution so long as your boogey man goes the way of the dodo bird.
This post was edited on 8/26/22 at 6:25 pm
Posted on 8/26/22 at 11:08 pm to chRxis
quote:
not at all... but i do support law enforcement agencies using the means at their disposal based on sufficient probable cause, in an effort to obtain evidence in a criminal complaint...
The issue is that presidents keeping materials that national archives wants is not a new one. These are negotiations that have taken place in every administration since I’ve been alive. The issue is these issues are handled through negotiation and at worst a civil suit. Because it is Trump the FBI conducted a raid and it is u unprecedented.
In fact, there is a ruling from the Clinton era that completely exonerates Trump even if everything the FBI is claiming is true.
However, I am hesitant to give the fbi the benefit of the doubt given what they did with the Russia setup.
This is purely political and I suspect you know it. From a strictly legal standpoint, it is very likely trump did anything wrong. There Is too much precedent to state otherwise. From a political standpoint this is unheard of. Frankly, I am surprised there are people defending it.
This post was edited on 8/26/22 at 11:09 pm
Posted on 8/27/22 at 3:15 am to BBONDS25
quote:
And there is literally no way the government can prove anything other than this.
You yourself agree that the president can declassified any document.
There is no way the fbi can prove these documents were not declassified.
They know this. We know this. You know this. If trump said he declassified them, well then that is kind of the way it goes.
So, just because someone saw a document that said super top secret, Trump can claim he declassified the document and the government can't do anything about it.
quote:
However, presidents generally follow an informal protocol when declassifying documents, Richard Immerman, a historian and professor at Temple University, told VERIFY.
First, the president will consult all departments and agencies that have an interest in a classified document. Those departments or agencies then provide their assessment as to whether the document should stay classified for national security reasons. If there is a dispute among the agencies, they debate, but the president ultimately makes the decision on declassification, Immerman explained.
quote:
The U.S. Second Circuit Court of Appeals wrote in a 2020 decision about whether statements made by then-President Trump declassified the existence of a CIA program that “declassification, even by the president, must follow established procedures.”
If a document is declassified, that doesn’t automatically mean it can be shared widely, either. For example, nuclear information – which is generally classified – is also protected by the federal Atomic Energy Act of 1954, McClanahan explained.
The Washington Post reported the FBI searched Mar-a-Lago for “nuclear documents,” among other classified information.
“Because [nuclear information] has this dual protection, even if you declassify a nuclear document, you cannot disseminate it because it’s still what’s called Restricted Data,” McClanahan said.
“So to the extent that he [Trump] had any nuclear information in there, declassification would not help him in the slightest, because he would still be disseminating restricted data or moving Restricted Data,” he added.
I don't think that's how it works. A President can't just say this is declassified and it be so. The said document needs to be dated, stamped, and signed by the authorizing person. The document also has to be marked or demarked stating that its status has changed.
I could be wrong tho.
quote:
There is no way the fbi can prove these documents were not declassified.
Your statement that the fbi can't prove it wasn't also means there is no way that Trump can prove it was.
So Trumps statement that it was declassified may be true but wasn't done in a legal way.
This post was edited on 8/27/22 at 3:31 am
Posted on 8/27/22 at 3:29 am to Bbobalou
Why are we wasting mental energy pretending as though this was a legitimate and unbiased exercise in law enforcement?
Where the frick have you been for the last 6 years?
Where the frick have you been for the last 6 years?
Posted on 8/27/22 at 3:35 am to Vacherie Saint
quote:
Why are we wasting mental energy pretending as though this was a legitimate and unbiased exercise in law enforcement?
I guess because some people feel it wasn't a legitimate and unbiased exercise.
Posted on 8/27/22 at 3:38 am to Bbobalou
Yes, people who aren’t lying to themselves do feel that way.
Posted on 8/27/22 at 6:23 am to Y.A. Tittle
It’s not a question of “if” he committed a crime, it’s how many crimes.
Posted on 8/27/22 at 6:34 am to thetempleowl
quote:
Except the argument that Trump declassified them will fly.
That argument hasn't been made except on Fox News.
Because it's fake, and only cult members believe it.
Page 6 of 6
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News