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Message
re: Where will Torres fit in
Posted on 9/7/11 at 12:07 am to americanoutlaw
Posted on 9/7/11 at 12:07 am to americanoutlaw
quote:
I'm not going to say jurgens' system doesn't fit our players just yet. I think the man is trying to mesh his tactics with the talent pool and it is going to take some time
I agree its way too early to try and draw any conclusions about Klinsi so far. A new system takes time but to me right now we're the team that passes the ball ok, has some possession and plays some good stuff at times but there is absolutely no end product. We're just toothless at the moment but I think as the players come to understand the system and learn when to wander forward and when to hold we will start seeing some goals.
As far as Torres goes, I think he's a very likable player and brings something very different to the table then any of our other midfielders (possibly with exception of Benny). I'm still not at all sold on him yet though and I do have some doubts about him being able to hold down a starting spot in what is easily our deepest position. I will say this about him though: those who say he isn't creating enough need to realize he's the kind of player who makes the pass before the pass. He sits deep and pulls strings but his game shouldn't be judged by statistics like goals and assists as that is not his role.
Torres has definitely beefed up the defensive side of his game a bit but I think that the SI rating had a few good points, although to give him a 4 is a bit ridiculous. I think his positioning as well as his off the ball play definitely lets him down at times.
0
Posted on 9/7/11 at 12:07 am to ThePhifer
If rogers has a role for us, it certainly is not as a starter. He might work as a 70th minute sub type.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 7:51 am to americanoutlaw
quote:
If rogers has a role for us, it certainly is not as a starter. He might work as a 70th minute sub type.
As long as he's (arguably) the fastest player in the pool, he's best as he played in the Mexico game.
Someone to make tired defenders chase.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 8:48 am to Sheep
quote:
Some good technical minutes are nice and all, but he still isn't making enough happen in the final third. (Stop us if you've heard this before.) Even when given the freedom after intermission to play a more advanced position, Torres passively preferring to orchestrate from more recessed areas. Sometimes that's OK, but eventually more aggressive action is required.
The answer is clear:
Posted on 9/7/11 at 8:53 am to Crede15
in the first half, it seemed as if klinsmann wanted dempsey and torres to function as a xavi-iniesta (obvious extreme gap in quality b/w the two pairs aside) partnership with edu breaking up play behind them. torres to retain and recycle possession primarily, and dempsey to look forward. i wasn't paying very close attn to the game, but i felt as if, even though torres moved forward in the second half, dempsey was still the focal point of the us attack and was given authority to roam, 'dolo picking up the slack out wide right.
anderson isn't exactly lightweight, and he doesn't play like he is. i think that while holden's work-rate and tackling ability could make it possible, i don't know how confident i would be in the back-line w/o much in front of it. it's easy to do when you have cms who can complete 85%+ of their passes, a world class forward who will track back and help, and cbs who are among some of the best in the world. it might be good to help them get by lower level teams. i'd shite myself if klinsmann trotted them out against a very good-elite team.
for the next game, i'd actually like to see shea out on the right. he isn't afraid to go past his man, and it is stupid to have him get to the end-line and ping crosses in to a single player, a fricking 6'1", 18 y/o striker being marked by vincent kompany. dempsey (left), shea (right) and donovan (assuming klinsmann wants him to be a central player) would at least be able to get some support to altidore and agudelo if we retain the single striker formation. chandler (if he stays on the left) and 'dolo will be able to get forward and provide width if we are keeping possession of the ball.
quote:
being too lightweight but really, where is the "steel" in a central midfield partnership of Anderson and Tom Cleverly?
anderson isn't exactly lightweight, and he doesn't play like he is. i think that while holden's work-rate and tackling ability could make it possible, i don't know how confident i would be in the back-line w/o much in front of it. it's easy to do when you have cms who can complete 85%+ of their passes, a world class forward who will track back and help, and cbs who are among some of the best in the world. it might be good to help them get by lower level teams. i'd shite myself if klinsmann trotted them out against a very good-elite team.
for the next game, i'd actually like to see shea out on the right. he isn't afraid to go past his man, and it is stupid to have him get to the end-line and ping crosses in to a single player, a fricking 6'1", 18 y/o striker being marked by vincent kompany. dempsey (left), shea (right) and donovan (assuming klinsmann wants him to be a central player) would at least be able to get some support to altidore and agudelo if we retain the single striker formation. chandler (if he stays on the left) and 'dolo will be able to get forward and provide width if we are keeping possession of the ball.
This post was edited on 9/7/11 at 8:55 am
Posted on 9/7/11 at 8:59 am to joey barton
Klinsmann has a long and storied track record of tactical success, so I'm certain he'll figure this out.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 9:32 am to Sheep
quote:
Klinsmann has a long and storied track record of tactical success, so I'm certain he'll figure this out.
blah blah blah. You're as bad as the people who blamed Bob for every bad touch over the past couple of years. And didn't you hate those people?
Posted on 9/7/11 at 10:09 am to uway
No worries.
Just let me know when to be inspired by what we see on the field.
I guess I just wasn't looking at the bright spots yesterday.
Or Friday.
Or last month.
Just let me know when to be inspired by what we see on the field.
I guess I just wasn't looking at the bright spots yesterday.
Or Friday.
Or last month.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 10:28 am to Sheep
quote:
Just let me know when to be inspired by what we see on the field.
I think he's just losing with Bob's players like Miles won with Saban's.
But seriously, Adu. Even though he's not playing for the Union.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 10:36 am to uway
quote:
But seriously, Adu. Even though he's not playing for the Union.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 11:01 am to uway
quote:
I think he's just losing with Bob's players like Miles won with Saban's.
it's the USA. it recruits itself.
klinsmann simply needs to put a fence around the USA and steal blue-chip talent from other countries.
juergen klinsmann's potential USMNT players list:
neymar
goetze
ronaldo
messi
xavi
iniesta
potential for failure: 0%
This post was edited on 9/7/11 at 11:18 am
Posted on 9/7/11 at 11:04 am to joey barton
quote:
klinsmann simply needs to put a fence around the USA and steal blue-chip talent from other countries.
I swear if Bob takes Mwanga to Egypt I'm putting a for sale sign in Jurgy's yard.
This post was edited on 9/7/11 at 11:05 am
Posted on 9/7/11 at 11:55 am to ThePhifer
Lots of fail in this thread.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 12:06 pm to Stewie Griffin
If we are sticking with 1 forward and move towards the 4-1-4-1 like some people are saying, I would like to see Holden and Torres in the middle with Bradley in the defensive midfield role.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 12:07 pm to Crede15
quote:
Could a Holden-Torres partnership work at times?
With Bradley behind them making runs into the box, yes. I'd love that. Get Dempsey and Donovan in narrow supporting roles with Jozy, and one fullback roaming, we'd be fine.
The biggest problem last night was movement off the ball. We were pretty tidy in possession, for the most part, but in the final third we got still. We also lacked a spurt, a drive. I think its either jet lag or just fatigue, but no one looked lively. Legs were heavy.
quote:
Beckerman deserves to be a permanent squad player the way he's playing
For sure. I think he's sixth on the pecking order (Bradley, Holden, Torres, Jones, Edu, Beckerman) and pushing up. Jones might not be in the picture for much longer, at least past 2014 for sure. Teh rest are young enough to be around.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 12:08 pm to Bho
quote:
Jozy needs a running mate. He isn't a lone striker and these half arse "forwards" that we have been putting out is all kinds of fail. I really want to see him and Juan. Juan has enough pace to be the lightning to Jozy's thunder. But shite, I don't really know soccer better than Jurgy so I'll bow to his beliefs.
I think Jozy can play lone striker, but he was absurdly bad last night. He couldn't hold the ball up at all. He just looked out of it.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 12:08 pm to hendersonshands
quote:
Jose Torres isn't an attacking midfielder
Bingo.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 12:09 pm to Sheep
quote:
He's being asked to be a #10, but not creating much. He's providing a lot of industry, but not much else.
Don't know if that's a product of him, the role he's in (currently), or the players around him.
It's Klinsmann trying to see if he can play that role. He may be able to, but it's not his best role.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 12:12 pm to joey barton
quote:
for the next game, i'd actually like to see shea out on the right
Shea needs a couple things to add to his arsenal.
1) A Cruyff. He's all left right now, but if he ever pulled it back to his right, he'd stop getting every cross deflected for a corner. He loses that battle a lot against international defenders.
2) A first touch on everything but his left. He's got a nice left footed touch, but if it hits his chest, right foot, thigh, or whatever, it's gone.
Posted on 9/7/11 at 12:23 pm to cwil177
quote:
the 4-1-4-1
Didn't work very well for Germany yesterday. Made the D look like a sieve.
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