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re: Possible Lakers and Twolves Trade
Posted on 6/19/11 at 12:31 am to Colonel Flagg
Posted on 6/19/11 at 12:31 am to Colonel Flagg
quote:
Minny was also retarded for passing on Curry for Flynn.
Hindsight is 20/20 my friend and Minny was stupid to take 2 PGs back to back to begin with in that draft.
1
Posted on 6/19/11 at 1:09 am to Tiger in Texas
quote:
If the Lakers could get the #2 pick for Gasol straight up, they would be doing cartwheels for months. My concern is from the standpoint of Minn.-Gasol is in no way worthy of the #2 pick in the draft!! Minn. would have to ask for more in order to pull the lever for the trade...
might be the worst analysis I have ever seen.Pau Gasol is certainly worth a number two pick in one of the weakest drafts in recent years.He is certainly worth that in DEEP drafts.
At the end of the day,Gasol is a proven commindity that helped LA win 2 titles and go to the finals twice.Derrick Williams,in this case,is an undersized tweener who hasn't played ONE minute of NBA basketball and you thinks it's fair value for an All-NBA level type player?
Posted on 6/19/11 at 1:11 am to NewGuy01
quote:
At the end of the day,Gasol is a proven commindity that helped LA win 2 titles and go to the finals twice.Derrick Williams,in this case,is an undersized tweener who hasn't played ONE minute of NBA basketball and you thinks it's fair value for an All-NBA level type player?
I see the salary cap issue on their side, but nonetheless, with Kobe's window closing, IMO you can't go taking chances on a #2 pick that isn't amywhere near 100% certain to be a great player.
You gotta ride out this window with Kobe without downgrading your team, IMO.
This post was edited on 6/19/11 at 1:12 am
Posted on 6/19/11 at 1:19 am to Tiger in Texas
quote:
Gasol is in no way worthy of the #2 pick in the draft!! Minn. would have to ask for more in order to pull the lever for the trade...
what in teh frick is going on here?
Posted on 6/19/11 at 1:20 am to mattz1122
quote:
That's what the Clippers (Bulls really, I guess) thought when they took Tyson Chandler.
for elton brand
Posted on 6/19/11 at 1:23 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
what in teh frick is going on here?
uninformed fans overreacting badly to a playoff sweep.
No informed NBA fan would ever suggest Pau straight up for the #2 pick, especially in this weak draft.
I don't think many would even consider the Pau for #2 and Love deal that was mentioned either.
Posted on 6/19/11 at 1:26 am to jacks40
big men who can play D and shoot well from FT are quite, quite rare
Posted on 6/19/11 at 1:28 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
big men who can play D and shoot well from FT are quite, quite rare
It is Pau's shity luck that he doesn't get the credit he deserves. Wout him no way the Lakers win 2 or even 1 IMO
Posted on 6/19/11 at 1:53 am to jacks40
quote:
It is Pau's shity luck that he doesn't get the credit he deserves. Wout him no way the Lakers win 2 or even 1 IMO
But...but...he's SOFT!!
Posted on 6/19/11 at 3:18 am to GeauxZone90
This is stupid for the Lakers in my opinion. You're trading a 7ft PF with tons of offense skill, a good enough rebounder, and a decent defensive player due to his size.
Having a player like that playing next to a 7ft C who's blossoming as a player every day puts you in title contention year end and year out.
Kevin Love is an undersized PF who's never been to the playoffs, never been on a winning team for that matter. He's a good player, but you don't trade him for a 7ft with rare skill. Anyone who thinks he's better than Pau is out of their mind.
I feel people are reacting to Pau's been playoff performance WAY too rashly. Let's not forget that outside of the 2008 finals, Pau has performed superbly in the playoffs and regular season. I will go as far to say it's debatable if the Lakers win any titles without him.
And what good is the #2 pick? Let's be real here. Kyrie Irving is going number one. So who do you take at that point? Derrick Williams? A tweener who's undersized for a 4 and oversized for a three, with little to no post game. That's almost identical to the player Kevin Love is.
A #2 pick SOUNDS amazing, but in a draft class as weak as this years, it's not as great as it sounds.
Having a player like that playing next to a 7ft C who's blossoming as a player every day puts you in title contention year end and year out.
Kevin Love is an undersized PF who's never been to the playoffs, never been on a winning team for that matter. He's a good player, but you don't trade him for a 7ft with rare skill. Anyone who thinks he's better than Pau is out of their mind.
I feel people are reacting to Pau's been playoff performance WAY too rashly. Let's not forget that outside of the 2008 finals, Pau has performed superbly in the playoffs and regular season. I will go as far to say it's debatable if the Lakers win any titles without him.
And what good is the #2 pick? Let's be real here. Kyrie Irving is going number one. So who do you take at that point? Derrick Williams? A tweener who's undersized for a 4 and oversized for a three, with little to no post game. That's almost identical to the player Kevin Love is.
A #2 pick SOUNDS amazing, but in a draft class as weak as this years, it's not as great as it sounds.
Posted on 6/19/11 at 4:24 am to LakerTiger
So basically Pau is better than Love because Pau has played for the Lakers and Kevin Love the Wolves.
If you can trade your 31 year old PF on a very old team for a 22 year old PF who scores and rebounds better, AND you get the #2 overall, you do it.
Who cares what they do with the #2 pick? They can trade it or take whoever they want. As much as people want to call it a shitty draft class (me included), we won't know for another few years.
If this deal is on the table, I think LA should take it and never look back. They instantly get significantly younger and I'm not convinced that they don't get better.
If you can trade your 31 year old PF on a very old team for a 22 year old PF who scores and rebounds better, AND you get the #2 overall, you do it.
Who cares what they do with the #2 pick? They can trade it or take whoever they want. As much as people want to call it a shitty draft class (me included), we won't know for another few years.
If this deal is on the table, I think LA should take it and never look back. They instantly get significantly younger and I'm not convinced that they don't get better.
Posted on 6/19/11 at 4:44 am to Ghazi
I just don't understand how anyone can like you....
Posted on 6/19/11 at 6:27 am to Ghazi
quote:
So basically Pau is better than Love because Pau has played for the Lakers and Kevin Love the Wolves.
If you can trade your 31 year old PF on a very old team for a 22 year old PF who scores and rebounds better, AND you get the #2 overall, you do it.
Who cares what they do with the #2 pick? They can trade it or take whoever they want. As much as people want to call it a shitty draft class (me included), we won't know for another few years.
If this deal is on the table, I think LA should take it and never look back. They instantly get significantly younger and I'm not convinced that they don't get better.
No Pau is better because Pau is better. He's taller. He's longer. He's better defensively. Much more of a threat for blocks in the paint. He's a better passer. He's a MUCH better scorer.
Now I know you're immediately going to say "but Kevin Love averages 20 points and Pau averages 19".
Pau averaged 19 points with the leagues 5th leading scorer on his team, and being the number two option.
Kevin Love put up 20 points a game being the number one option on his team, and the only other legit scoring threat on his team being Michael Beasley.
Not too add Pau shoots a much better field goal percentage than him.
AND Pau has never averaged less than 17.5 points per game his WHOLE CAREER. Meaning, his rookie season included.
Kevin Love averaged 11 and 14 points respectively his first 2 seasons.
AND most of Kevin Loves points come from put backs, threes, or hitting a mid range jumper.
Outside of hitting threes, Pau does ALL of that AND he has a post game which is HUGE for a PF.
The only thing Kevin Love has on Pau is his age and rebounding.
The Lakers were 3rd in the league in rebounding last year, so rebounding isn't an issue that needs to be addressed.
And at the age of 30, Pau has atleast 2-3 years of continuing to play at this level.
Maybe even more because he's only been in the NBA 9 years, which is not a lot for someone his age, and he has no history of injury.
The main issues with taking that #2 pick is:
A. Like I said, if you make the pick, Derrick Williams is more than likely not going to be more than a bench player to small time starter in this league. Yeah, he could prove scouts wrong, but that's the more than likely what's going to happen. He's a tweener who is shaky on a lot of the skills needed for his position(s).
B. Like you said, you don't know what's going to come of that draft pick in such a shaky draft class. It's WAY too much of a risk.
C. With this draft class being weak, the value of that pick is a lot lower, and so the trade value for it isn't what you would get in typical years. Why do you think there's so much talk of these struggling teams wanting to trade these high picks away?
I just think there's an overreaction to this playoff loss. We don't go to the finals for the 4th year in a row and everyone immediately wants to hit the panic button and blow up what's worked for us 3 out of the last 4 years.
The issue for most of this season (outside of the playoffs) wasn't Pau. It was a need for a more athletic and better shooting swing man, youth and consistent shooting at the PG position, and more consistent bench play.
Those are the issues that need to be addressed and they don't get addressed in this trade scenario.
Posted on 6/19/11 at 9:03 am to Ghazi
Ok
Posted on 6/19/11 at 9:22 am to LakerTiger
Kevin Love is the best player on the Wolves. When playing them, other teams' defensive strategies are built around stopping him. Pau has the benefit of playing next to Kobe. He doesn't have the pressure of being the best player. He doesn't see those same defenses.
Don't punish Love because his points come from outrebounding others and shooting the three ball. And just because the Lakers rebound well doesn't mean they wouldn't be interested in adding the best rebounder in the league. He averages more offensive and defensive rebounds a game than Dwight Howard and he does it in less minutes/game.
Pau may have 2-3 solid years left? Love may have 13.
Maybe LA trades the second pick to Detroit for the 7th and whatever else, and LA takes Brandon Knight there.
Stop assuming that everyone is overreacting to the playoffs. Pau is great but Love allows them to get significantly younger for much cheaper, and, in my opinion, better for a longer period of time.
Don't punish Love because his points come from outrebounding others and shooting the three ball. And just because the Lakers rebound well doesn't mean they wouldn't be interested in adding the best rebounder in the league. He averages more offensive and defensive rebounds a game than Dwight Howard and he does it in less minutes/game.
Pau may have 2-3 solid years left? Love may have 13.
Maybe LA trades the second pick to Detroit for the 7th and whatever else, and LA takes Brandon Knight there.
Stop assuming that everyone is overreacting to the playoffs. Pau is great but Love allows them to get significantly younger for much cheaper, and, in my opinion, better for a longer period of time.
Posted on 6/19/11 at 10:30 am to TotesMcGotes
if i'm the lake show, priority #1 should be setting myself up to get dwight. if i don't get him and the clippers put anyone around blake, l.a. bandwagon fans will make me yesterday's news
Posted on 6/19/11 at 11:01 am to marchballer
quote:
Hindsight is 20/20 my friend and Minny was stupid to take 2 PGs back to back to begin with in that draft.
I don't remember Flynn ever being considered a better prospect that Curry. I was blown away draft bight by that pick.
With the hype of Rubio if I was the GM I probably would have taken Curry and Rubio.
Posted on 6/19/11 at 7:29 pm to TotesMcGotes
quote:
Kevin Love is the best player on the Wolves. When playing them, other teams' defensive strategies are built around stopping him. Pau has the benefit of playing next to Kobe. He doesn't have the pressure of being the best player. He doesn't see those same defenses.
Don't punish Love because his points come from outrebounding others and shooting the three ball. And just because the Lakers rebound well doesn't mean they wouldn't be interested in adding the best rebounder in the league. He averages more offensive and defensive rebounds a game than Dwight Howard and he does it in less minutes/game.
Pau may have 2-3 solid years left? Love may have 13.
Maybe LA trades the second pick to Detroit for the 7th and whatever else, and LA takes Brandon Knight there.
Stop assuming that everyone is overreacting to the playoffs. Pau is great but Love allows them to get significantly younger for much cheaper, and, in my opinion, better for a longer period of time.
Pau spent the majority of his whole career being the number one option in Memphis. And as I stated earlier, he averaged 17.5 - 21 points per game his whole time there.
Not too add, he took that team to the THREE STRAIGHT PLAYOFF APPEARANCES, and had winning seasons there with a sub-par supporting cast. Something Kevin Love has yet to do. He's the number one option and has yet to help that team win more than 17 games in a season.
I'm not punishing Kevin Love for how he scores, but simply trying to show you the fact that Pau is a much more versatile and better scorer.
Why would a team that is already third in the league as a team in rebounding, want to give up everything that Pau offers you that Kevin Love doesn't to be a little bit better of a rebounding team and a get a little younger at 1 position? (And let's be real here, he's not going to be putting up those same rebounding numbers playing next to Andrew Bynum)
That's the point that I'm trying to stress here. Acquiring Kevin Love doesn't really address any of our NEEDS.
And Brandon Knight? Are you kidding me? First off, there's a chance he doesn't even fall to 7th. Secondly, he's a few year project at this point. Thirdly, he's a scoring point guard and not a true point guard. The last thing the Lakers need is the same problem The Heat and Oklahoma City have which is two players in the back court who need to ball in their hands to be effective, and want to score that way.
And if this isn't people's overreaction to the playoffs then tell me why there was ZERO talk of even possibly trading Pau before now? The idea of trading Pau before his playoff performance would have been LAUGHED at.
If you really think that once Kobe's gone that the Lakers should leave there team who has a higher standard for winning than any other organization in the league due to their rich history, to an undersized PF with a questionable post game whos never won more than 17 games as the number one option on his team then you are out of your mind.
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