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re: Herd Turns on Hunters After They Gun Down Bull Elephant
Posted on 10/18/18 at 1:51 pm to BlindTiger7
Posted on 10/18/18 at 1:51 pm to BlindTiger7
quote:
A true neanderthal would.
Explains why he's no longer around.
0
Posted on 10/18/18 at 1:57 pm to GetCocky11
quote:
I just don't understand what the thrill is.
Sounds like it's escaping the angry herd
Posted on 10/18/18 at 1:58 pm to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
Guess what’s legal in some African countries?
I'll try this again. I didn't say it was immoral, and while I was replying to a thread that was discussing the morality of the act, I simply said I thought it was a bit weird/sick that some would derive pleasure from that. That is independent legality or morals. It is simply odd to me that people high five and celebrate after blasting to death a huge animal who was not threatened by them and simply eating grass.
Posted on 10/18/18 at 2:12 pm to Chucktown_Badger
quote:
I didn't say it was immoral, and while I was replying to a thread that was discussing the morality of the act, I simply said I thought it was a bit weird/sick that some would derive pleasure from that.
I will quote the entire exchange for you
quote:
But what is immoral about killing an elephant when killing a chicken is just fine?
For starters, the chicken isn't killed for "sport". If we weren't going to eat the entire thing we wouldn't kill it. (As an aside, if the person killing the chicken gets a boner/takes a selfie/high fives his boys with the carcass each time he kills one, I would agree it's also weird). Also, chickens are a bit more abundant than elephants.
You directly responded to a morality question with an answer that included the number of chickens vs the number of elephants
This post was edited on 10/18/18 at 2:12 pm
Posted on 10/18/18 at 2:17 pm to GetCocky11
I’m a hunter and there is ABSOLUTELY no skill in hunting an elephant
Posted on 10/18/18 at 2:19 pm to GetCocky11
quote:
How is there any skill in hunting an elephant?
How is there any skill in hunting with a gun?
Go hunt with a bow and arrow. Old school it.
Posted on 10/18/18 at 2:58 pm to Thib-a-doe Tiger
If you want to talk about conservation and regional benefit then read this 110 page report by the UICN.
There's little to no benefit from safari hunts. A resident of an African country with hunts can expect to receive an average of $3 USD per year. It seems that the major conservation benefit is the set-aside of hunting land that prevents further encroachment of human populations. The same effect could be achieved with national parks, which tend to support much higher animal densities.
They did find that well managed hunting has not caused local disappearance of a particular species, so that's something a little better than nothing.
There's little to no benefit from safari hunts. A resident of an African country with hunts can expect to receive an average of $3 USD per year. It seems that the major conservation benefit is the set-aside of hunting land that prevents further encroachment of human populations. The same effect could be achieved with national parks, which tend to support much higher animal densities.
They did find that well managed hunting has not caused local disappearance of a particular species, so that's something a little better than nothing.
Posted on 10/18/18 at 3:07 pm to WildManGoose
quote:
A resident of an African country with hunts can expect to receive an average of $3 USD per year.
Holy making up a stat, Batman. Why would it be separated on a per capita basis? Gonna lump all of the people who have nothing to do with it in there?
quote:
They did find that well managed hunting has not caused local disappearance of a particular species, so that's something a little better than nothing.
This is being intellectually dishonest. There were many species on the list who were endangered who have made a resurgence since paid hunting came about. The land set aside and conservation dollars invested have paid off in spades. Farmers would slaughter animals and leave them to rot to protect their crops, since the animals had 0 monetary value to them. The same thing would happen again if you just designated everything as a national park
This post was edited on 10/18/18 at 3:08 pm
Posted on 10/18/18 at 3:09 pm to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
You directly responded to a morality question with an answer that included the number of chickens vs the number of elephants
I was responding more to the chickens vs. elephants question, but allow me to restate for the third time...making no judgements of legality or morality, it's weird that people get off on killing a huge animal that is neither elusive nor difficult to shoot. It's just killing for the sake of killing.
Posted on 10/18/18 at 3:13 pm to Chucktown_Badger
And trophy hunting does not contribute near as much as tourism to simply see and photograph those animals. Hell, I even saw a National Geographic article that said some hunts allow people to shoot the animals...with darts filled with vitamins as opposed to bullets. But I'm assuming of course, it's only "sporting" if you're able to actually kill the animal.
(Full context posted for both sides of the coin)
LINK
(Full context posted for both sides of the coin)
LINK
quote:
How does trophy hunting compare to regular tourism?
Trophy hunting accounts for a fraction of the R323 billion that tourism contributed to South Africa’s GDP in 2013. About 8,500 trophy hunters visit South Africa each year, compared to around 9.5 million tourists.
The 2006 Biological Conservation paper estimated “a minimum of 18,500” hunters participated in hunts annually in sub-Saharan Africa (generating revenue of around US$201 million), compared to World Bank estimates of around 33.8 million visitors in 2012, earning the region US$36 billion.
Saayman says that while the numbers of hunters and the contribution to GDP is small, trophy hunters “tend to spend far more than an average tourist and in areas where tourists usually would not go”.
In a 2014 paper, he and two co-authors investigated the economic impact of hunting in South Africa’s Limpopo, Northern Cape and Free State provinces. “The research found 17,806 (Limpopo), 9,072 (Northern Cape) and 4,558 (Free State) jobs may depend on hunting, in addition to those of people permanently employed on game farms,” Saayman said.
A resource economist who worked across Southern Africa and established a national environmental economics programme in Namibia, Dr Jon Barnes, wrote in a 2001 paper: “Consumptive wildlife uses [such as hunting] are relatively unimportant in terms of economic contribution, but they are the only use values possible in the less well-endowed two-thirds of the wildlife estate.”
Similarly, Dr John Hanks, a zoologist and former chief executive of WWF South Africa, argues that “where there are high wildlife densities and scenically attractive landscapes, there is greater potential for photographic tourism than for trophy hunting.
“However, in those areas where large mammals are few and scattered and the scenery is mundane, photographic safaris will not be viable. Here the better land-use option for biodiversity conservation can often be trophy hunting rather than domestic livestock and shifting agriculture. More significantly for resident communities, they have an incentive to protect the large mammals that would otherwise be seen as a threat to their livelihoods.”
This post was edited on 10/18/18 at 3:17 pm
Posted on 10/18/18 at 3:15 pm to Chucktown_Badger
quote:
And trophy hunting does not contribute near as much as tourism to simply see and photograph those animals.
How much of that tourism money goes to helping the animals?
Posted on 10/18/18 at 3:22 pm to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
How much of that tourism money goes to helping the animals?
Not sure. But even if it's only 1%, that's significantly more than the TOTAL revenue generated from trophy hunting.
Also, it appears that it's difficult to determine how much from trophy hunting actually goes toward conservation.
quote:
While well-regulated hunting in the U.S. does funnel taxes and fees from hunters to conservation efforts, the same cannot be said about Africa, where widespread corruption and mismanaged conservation programs keep money from protecting threatened species, according to the finding of the Democratic staff of the House Committee on Natural Resources.
While poaching is still the biggest threat to animals such as lions, leopards and rhinoceroses, trophy hunting is also a significant factor in killing members of "these rapidly declining populations," the 25-page House report said.
Big-game hunters can pay tens of thousands of dollars to cover trophy fees, professional guides, transportation and lodging, money that has been used to maintain conservation efforts in poor nations. Still, in tracking where trophy hunting revenue landed, the report cited "many troubling examples of funds either being diverted from their purpose or not being dedicated to conservation in the first place."
This post was edited on 10/18/18 at 3:23 pm
Posted on 10/18/18 at 4:38 pm to Darth_Vader
Outside of heard population control people who hunt elephants today are kind of dicks in my opinion (not that my opinion matters much).
What kind of sport is it shooting a slow arse elephant?
What kind of sport is it shooting a slow arse elephant?
Posted on 10/18/18 at 4:46 pm to GetCocky11
Thank God for those hunters saving those elephants. Sure. Right. People who do this are evil. Elephants been proven to mourn
Posted on 10/18/18 at 4:52 pm to LSUballsack
quote:
law over morals
Money from trophy hunting in Africa does more to fund conservation than any Facebook meme or like.
Posted on 10/18/18 at 4:55 pm to Chucktown_Badger
quote:
Not sure. But even if it's only 1%, that's significantly more than the TOTAL revenue generated from trophy hunting. Also, it appears that it's difficult to determine how much from trophy hunting actually goes toward conservation.
Wildlife management in many African countries is incredible corrupt. When I lived in Kenya it was common knowledge that wildlife management officials, and low level game wardens were paid off by organized poaching operations. Most of the actual anti-poaching work was paid for by tourist resorts and tour operators, with the elimination of poachers done by private contractors.
Posted on 10/18/18 at 4:58 pm to EA6B
quote:
Wildlife management in many African countries is incredible corrupt
Is there anything on that shithole continent that isn’t corrupt?
Posted on 10/18/18 at 5:03 pm to Darth_Vader
I love hunting but big game hunting in Africa is so stupid. It’s basically a bunch of rich dudes pissing away money shooting animals they had to do minimal work to kill.
I’d be okay with it if you had to backpack out into the bush, track, find and kill something and carry it back. There is no sport in going out to a reserve and having a guide tell you which endangered animal to kill.
ETA: and I don’t trust the wildlife management people there. They probably pocket the majority of the money and very little goes into conservation like they say.
I’d be okay with it if you had to backpack out into the bush, track, find and kill something and carry it back. There is no sport in going out to a reserve and having a guide tell you which endangered animal to kill.
ETA: and I don’t trust the wildlife management people there. They probably pocket the majority of the money and very little goes into conservation like they say.
This post was edited on 10/18/18 at 5:05 pm
Posted on 10/18/18 at 5:08 pm to olemissfan26
quote:
I’d be okay with it if you had to backpack out into the bush, track, find and kill something and carry it back. There is no sport in going out to a reserve and having a guide tell you which endangered animal to kill.
It is always amazing how the guides/"trackers" miraculously find the game right before your hunt is scheduled to end, they knew exactly where the animals were the first day the hunters arrived, its nothing but outdoor theater.
Posted on 10/18/18 at 5:10 pm to olemissfan26
quote:
rich dudes pissing away money
You sound jealous
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