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Started By
Message
re: RE: corporate tax cuts
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:22 pm to Haughton99
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:22 pm to Haughton99
Who is it that you think owns corporations? Who benefits from corporations being more profitable?
3
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:23 pm to Haughton99
quote:
You mouth breathing Trumpkins are mindless sheep who believe anything Fox News tells you.
Yet you keep repeating this ridiculous line that's repeated 1000 times a day on Facebook by some stupid group
It's economics, stupid. It doesn't take a Trumpkin to understand it
This post was edited on 11/21/17 at 2:25 pm
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:24 pm to jawnybnsc
quote:
Raising taxes and expanding government intervention in peoples lives are what Democrats promise. Funny thing . . . people take them at their word.
Yep, and look where we are with entitlements
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:24 pm to HeyHeyHogsAllTheWay
quote:
Why on Earth would you possibly be okay with a company lying to you or the government?
Why would the government be entitled to an accounting of a corporations expenditures? That's the real question here.
quote:
That's why this country is so fricked up, we are led by Congressman who lie to us who are influenced by lobbyists who lie to us , but they keep getting elected by idiots like you who don't care that we are being lied to.
You are an absolute tool. What in God's name does lying politicians have to do with corporate autonomy?
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:26 pm to Haughton99
quote:
No they haven't. They've moved production overseas because of lower wages required to do the same work. Cutting taxes doesn't fix that at all.
So?
quote:
When you factor in deductions we are competitive with the rest of the world when it comes to taxes. If any corporation in the US pays anywhere near the actual tax rate then they should fire their CFO immediately.
So lower the rates and end the cronyism.
quote:
The old trickle down theory that never ever in the history of ever has actually happened.
And no nation has ever taxed it's way to prosperity. Seems like we're destined to be stuck with something less than utopia.
quote:
You mouth breathing Trumpkins are mindless sheep who believe anything Fox News tells you.
Wow . . . did you think that up all by yourself?
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:26 pm to Haughton99
You Lefties are also ignorant about the issue of “Leverage” in this country.
About 98% of small-to-large cap corporations in the US are over 40% leveraged.
Meaning they use bank/investor/creditor loans to supplant cash flow and pad their bottom lines.
These loans cost interest. Lots and lots of interest. Interest that is a zero-sum product and generates NO GDP, and is actually used as a deduction off corporate revenues, which equates to less tax revenues paid.
By lowering corporate tax rates, corporations will keep more of their corporate revenues, and as a result will also lower their leveraged finances. And ultimately pay more in taxes while staying even better financially sound and healthy.
There is much more to this than just CEO’s getting paid bigger bonuses and the rich getting richer.
About 98% of small-to-large cap corporations in the US are over 40% leveraged.
Meaning they use bank/investor/creditor loans to supplant cash flow and pad their bottom lines.
These loans cost interest. Lots and lots of interest. Interest that is a zero-sum product and generates NO GDP, and is actually used as a deduction off corporate revenues, which equates to less tax revenues paid.
By lowering corporate tax rates, corporations will keep more of their corporate revenues, and as a result will also lower their leveraged finances. And ultimately pay more in taxes while staying even better financially sound and healthy.
There is much more to this than just CEO’s getting paid bigger bonuses and the rich getting richer.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:27 pm to BBONDS25
That's why I always ask these statist morons where the consumer fits in their picture. They never seem to get it.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:28 pm to Haughton99
quote:
If you increase their net profit by lowering their taxes
You can't increase net profit for the year by lowering taxes.
You pay your taxes on the profits you make.
The corporate tax reforms are to make US corporations competitive. In the worldwide economy they can't compete as well with companies that pay less taxes.
Also higher taxes have pushed companies to leave the US to go elsewhere. Why would you want to taxes to push corporations to leave?
Let corporations keep more money. It's not the government's money. Corporations and businesses that keep more money can afford to grow their work force in order to expand their businesses. They can do that by hiring more people by training more workers or by increasing wages and wage packages.
Wages have been relatively flat. We haven't done anything but tax corporations to leave the country. Let's try relaxing taxes and let's see if wages increase faster than they did under Obama.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:30 pm to BBONDS25
quote:
Who is it that you think owns corporations
Shareholders own corporations. The people own corporations.
Keep government as far away from any corporate entity doing it's best to benefit it's shareholders.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:32 pm to BeefDawg
quote:
You Lefties are also ignorant about the issue of “Leverage” in this country.
About 98% of small-to-large cap corporations in the US are over 40% leveraged.
Meaning they use bank/investor/creditor loans to supplant cash flow and pad their bottom lines.
These loans cost interest. Lots and lots of interest. Interest that is a zero-sum product and generates NO GDP, and is actually used as a deduction off corporate revenues, which equates to less tax revenues paid.
By lowering corporate tax rates, corporations will keep more of their corporate revenues, and as a result will also lower their leveraged finances. And ultimately pay more in taxes while staying even better financially sound and healthy.
There is much more to this than just CEO’s getting paid bigger bonuses and the rich getting richer.
I almost mentioned that firms will start getting better interest rates with a healthier balance sheet as well.
Granted, I expect rates to start ticking up even more here soon, but it's all relative.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:32 pm to BBONDS25
quote:
Who is it that you think owns corporations? Who benefits from corporations being more profitable?
Most corporations in the U.S. are privately held. The public ones through the issuance of stock can add profit to people, but, I assure you after working with large ones over the years, they really only like a few people making any real money ...for control purposes and they make sure of it. That's why Carl Icahn gets a say with Chesapeake and I as a shareholder(former) do not.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:34 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
Profitability ensures competition
This actually makes no sense whatsoever.
quote:
competition which drives innovation
You're almost onto something here. Competition does drive innovation.
quote:
competition which drives innovation and employment.
Uh oh. Lost me here. Competition doesn't drive employment. The company with the most employees doesn't win.
quote:
The less profitable an industry is determines there will be less opportunity
Again, this sentence makes no sense and would cause an economist physical pain by reading it.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:37 pm to Haughton99
quote:
No they haven't. They've moved production overseas because of lower wages required to do the same work. Cutting taxes doesn't fix that at all.
Is it possible, that a companies expenditures might influence it's operating costs?
quote:
When you factor in deductions we are competitive with the rest of the world when it comes to taxes. If any corporation in the US pays anywhere near the actual tax rate then they should fire their CFO immediately.
Why do you insist on maintaining stupid? Cut taxes and cut deductions.
quote:
The old trickle down theory that never ever in the history of ever has actually happened.
Except in every business model that has at least 1 employee. Do you think it's poor people that start businesses? Do you think businesses just start with x number of employees and never grow?
quote:
Haughton99
You have many problems, but your main problem here is you dont' understand economics, the free market, or business at all. You are under some delusion that every corporation is the size of Boeing or Wal-Mart. Thus, all of your brain farts are borne of this idea that corporations are run by fat old bald white guys petting their cats. You do understand that a corporation is a business filing. It could consist of 1 person, or hundreds. But, let's make sure common sense doesn't get in the way of your liberal meltdown.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:37 pm to Erin Go Bragh
quote:
Why would the government be entitled to an accounting of a corporations expenditures? That's the real question here.
Look moron
The ONLY fricking question I'm asking here is this
"would you make the law so that companies would have to do what they have said they would do in order to get the lower tax rate?"
This doesn't require some deep discussion about what's the best tax rate, or anything else. It's just a simple question of do you believe that Congress should you know expect people to do what they say are going to do.
For real, how fricking retarded are you that you need that explained to you five times? Am I using too big of words?
The reason for the question is simple. I , and most Americans, don't believe most of the tax saving would go towards what companies say it would. Most people know exactly where this money would go, right in the hands of the already rich. But they can't just admit "yes we want tax breaks so we can keep more of our own money in our own pockets" because no politician would support that because the masses aren't going to vote for politicians who openly pass laws that help the rich get even richer.
So instead these companies are saying "oh yes tax breaks . well build new factories and hire new employees and we can pay more too" so should Congress make them stick to their word?
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:39 pm to Haughton99
quote:
No they haven't. They've moved production overseas because of lower wages required to do the same work. Cutting taxes doesn't fix that at all.
bullshite. Labor costs are only a portion of the reason. Tax rates, trade deals, currency exchange, and over-regulation are also a huge part of the reason. Most of those are being reworked along with the corporate tax rate reduction, negating the downside of higher labor costs.
Companies want to be here. We have the biggest economy on the planet by a lot and the most consumers with the most money to spend by a lot.
This isn’t JUST about a corp tax rate cut. There is an entire plan in place that combined makes it extremely attractive to setup shop in the US.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:40 pm to HeyHeyHogsAllTheWay
quote:
would you make the law so that companies would have to do what they have said they would do in order to get the lower tax rate?"
And this makes the third time I've answered the question.
No No No
quote:
Look moron
This post was edited on 11/21/17 at 2:41 pm
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:40 pm to doubleb
quote:
You can't increase net profit for the year by lowering taxes.
You pay your taxes on the profits you make.
The corporate tax reforms are to make US corporations competitive. In the worldwide economy they can't compete as well with companies that pay less taxes.
Also higher taxes have pushed companies to leave the US to go elsewhere. Why would you want to taxes to push corporations to leave?
Let corporations keep more money. It's not the government's money. Corporations and businesses that keep more money can afford to grow their work force in order to expand their businesses. They can do that by hiring more people by training more workers or by increasing wages and wage packages.
Wages have been relatively flat. We haven't done anything but tax corporations to leave the country. Let's try relaxing taxes and let's see if wages increase faster than they did under Obama.
I'm curious as to Haughton's expert response to this.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:41 pm to Erin Go Bragh
quote:
Keep government as far away from any corporate entity doing it's best to benefit it's shareholders.
of course companies are supposed to do what's best for their owners, but that isn't always whats best for the country overall, and we have formed a GOVERNMENT which is strictly designed to make sure that they can sometimes tell people "no you can't do what's best for you here because it would hurt others"
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:42 pm to KiwiHead
quote:
Most corporations in the U.S. are privately held. The public ones through the issuance of stock can add profit to people, but, I assure you after working with large ones over the years, they really only like a few people making any real money ...for control purposes and they make sure of it. That's why Carl Icahn gets a say with Chesapeake and I as a shareholder(former) do not.
I do agree that fewer publicly-held companies vis a vis twenty or fifty years ago is a problem for building wealth for most Americans, but that's something that I think will start to solve itself when interest rates start really rising again. Two reasons:
- Large, privately-held legacy firms (the Mars' and Bechtel's of the world) can access huge sums of capital very cheaply and have been able to since 2008. Higher rates will probably start making the public markets look more attractive. IPO's have slowed to a trickle - I don't think that's sustainable.
- The new big boys (Uber, Palantir, AirBnB, etc.) have access to absolutely enormous PE and VC funds right now as institutional investors have increasingly chased diminishing returns. I also don't think that will be as attractive when rates start rising again.
Posted on 11/21/17 at 2:43 pm to Haughton99
quote:
The company with the most employees doesn't win.
But, the winning company generally has the most employees.
Walmart has more than Sears.
Apple has more than Palm
etc
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