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Started By
Message
re: Mesut Özil announces his international retirement
Posted on 7/23/18 at 12:40 am to crazy4lsu
Posted on 7/23/18 at 12:40 am to crazy4lsu
Bluefin's explanation is on point.
Also, I am not sure if/when Ozil has met with Erdogan beforehand. However, this was right before the election when he posed with Ilkay Gundogan and Cenk Tosun. These guys are either Erdogan supporters or naive to the point of having the political IQ of a 5 year old. I clearly believe it is the former. And in the German political realm, these three guys taking a photo with Erdogan is an extremely transparent PR ploy/get out the vote effort by Erdogan and the AKP for a super important demographic.
Germany obviously has a huge diaspora of Turks and Erodgan has long had his sights set on the Turkish vote there. One of his most clever moves has been greatly lowering the fee that dual nationals can pay to avoid military service.
In the past, it cost about 10-15K to get out of compulsory military service and enroll in a 3 week program instead. You had to be a dual national with 36 months of foreign employment in order to be eligible. As a result, pretty much the only people who could do this were professional athletes, graduate students in PhD programs abroad, and wealthy Turks who lived abroad and their children. This was disproportionately in the US, whereas the millions of German Turks didn't have the resources as they came from entirely different backgrounds and economic means. Erdogan slashed the fee for this down to 1000 Euros and eliminated even the three week requirement, making it much easier for German Turks to keep their citizenship, avoid compulsory military service.
This made him very popular with the German Turkish population, many of whom were already in favor of the AKP to begin with.
In what was expected to be a very contested election, Erodgan wanted to get as many votes as possible and he wanted to align himself with some famous and well-liked individuals. He's obviously not going to get many singers, actors, and of course no models, so he went with sportsmen. I assume Enen Kanter's phone line was busy.
On the other hand, Emre Can declined to meet with Erdogan and didn't join Gundogan, Ozil, or Cenk Tosun.
Now, why would the Germans be against their well known celebrities promoting a foreign candidate? It's very clearly because of Erodgan's ideology, his issues with Merkel, and his autocratic rule that has led to more journalists being imprisoned per capita than China, Iran, or Pakistan. Nobody would have said a word if Klose took a photo with a centrist Polish politician, or for that matter, if Emre Can took a photo with Muaharrem Ince (I realize that is a bit speculative, but I am confident in that assertion).
German politicians, journalists, and even soccer administrators have valid reasons for this critique, and Ozil is nothing more than a disingenuous coward who has been coddled his whole life and can't respond to valid criticism. Instead, he tries to appeal to center-left sensibilities and claim racism. This may work in the US but I am highly doubtful Germans who understand the situation better would fall for such weak shite.
ETA: Meant to say Ilkay Gundogan instead of Kerim Demirbay
Also, I am not sure if/when Ozil has met with Erdogan beforehand. However, this was right before the election when he posed with Ilkay Gundogan and Cenk Tosun. These guys are either Erdogan supporters or naive to the point of having the political IQ of a 5 year old. I clearly believe it is the former. And in the German political realm, these three guys taking a photo with Erdogan is an extremely transparent PR ploy/get out the vote effort by Erdogan and the AKP for a super important demographic.
Germany obviously has a huge diaspora of Turks and Erodgan has long had his sights set on the Turkish vote there. One of his most clever moves has been greatly lowering the fee that dual nationals can pay to avoid military service.
In the past, it cost about 10-15K to get out of compulsory military service and enroll in a 3 week program instead. You had to be a dual national with 36 months of foreign employment in order to be eligible. As a result, pretty much the only people who could do this were professional athletes, graduate students in PhD programs abroad, and wealthy Turks who lived abroad and their children. This was disproportionately in the US, whereas the millions of German Turks didn't have the resources as they came from entirely different backgrounds and economic means. Erdogan slashed the fee for this down to 1000 Euros and eliminated even the three week requirement, making it much easier for German Turks to keep their citizenship, avoid compulsory military service.
This made him very popular with the German Turkish population, many of whom were already in favor of the AKP to begin with.
In what was expected to be a very contested election, Erodgan wanted to get as many votes as possible and he wanted to align himself with some famous and well-liked individuals. He's obviously not going to get many singers, actors, and of course no models, so he went with sportsmen. I assume Enen Kanter's phone line was busy.
On the other hand, Emre Can declined to meet with Erdogan and didn't join Gundogan, Ozil, or Cenk Tosun.
Now, why would the Germans be against their well known celebrities promoting a foreign candidate? It's very clearly because of Erodgan's ideology, his issues with Merkel, and his autocratic rule that has led to more journalists being imprisoned per capita than China, Iran, or Pakistan. Nobody would have said a word if Klose took a photo with a centrist Polish politician, or for that matter, if Emre Can took a photo with Muaharrem Ince (I realize that is a bit speculative, but I am confident in that assertion).
German politicians, journalists, and even soccer administrators have valid reasons for this critique, and Ozil is nothing more than a disingenuous coward who has been coddled his whole life and can't respond to valid criticism. Instead, he tries to appeal to center-left sensibilities and claim racism. This may work in the US but I am highly doubtful Germans who understand the situation better would fall for such weak shite.
ETA: Meant to say Ilkay Gundogan instead of Kerim Demirbay
This post was edited on 7/23/18 at 2:55 am
Posted on 7/23/18 at 2:47 am to Keys Open Doors
He's met Erdogan a couple of times, according to some pictures I've seen on Reddit. I can't attest to the accuracy of the dates of the pictures, though.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 5:54 am to crazy4lsu
Harsh
quote:
Mesut Ozil Germany retirement: Bayern Munich president Uli Hoeness labels Arsenal star "s**t for years"
"Ozil has been playing s**t for years," he told SportBild . "He won his last tackle before the 2014 World Cup.
"All he is doing on the field is playing cross passes. Now he hides himself and his crap performance behind this photo."
"Whenever we played against Arsenal, we played on him because we knew he was the weak point," he said.
"No-one questioned he was playing crap at the World Cup," he said.
"His 35 million follower boys, who of course do not exist in the real world, all think that he has played excellently if he plays a cross pass."
This post was edited on 7/23/18 at 5:58 am
Posted on 7/23/18 at 7:36 am to TFTC
quote:
"He won his last tackle before the 2014 World Cup."
Mesut wasn't winning any tackles prior to 2014 either
Posted on 7/23/18 at 7:58 am to TFTC
Ozil created the most chances per 90 at the World Cup. I don’t know all the politics here but he’s still quality. Hope selfishly this keeps him fresher for Arsenal.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 8:24 am to TFTC
The Germans may be right, but they are coming off as super dickheads in this whole ordeal.
They could have just made some generic we are against racism press release and this would have probably gone away by now.
They could have just made some generic we are against racism press release and this would have probably gone away by now.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 9:46 am to Dead End
quote:
Good. He's overrated.
L O fricking L
Posted on 7/23/18 at 11:32 am to TFTC
quote:
Mesut Ozil Germany retirement: Bayern Munich president Uli Hoeness labels Arsenal star "s**t for years"
"Ozil has been playing s**t for years," he told SportBild . "He won his last tackle before the 2014 World Cup.
"All he is doing on the field is playing cross passes. Now he hides himself and his crap performance behind this photo."
"Whenever we played against Arsenal, we played on him because we knew he was the weak point," he said.
"No-one questioned he was playing crap at the World Cup," he said.
"His 35 million follower boys, who of course do not exist in the real world, all think that he has played excellently if he plays a cross pass."

Posted on 7/23/18 at 3:30 pm to dgnx6
quote:
Not his fault Hummel's shouldered that ball out. Put it on a fricking platter.
better than a platter. He put it on his fricking forehead. but Mats did everything in his physical being to make sure he missed it. make his dumbass retire
TYFYS Mesut
/melt
This post was edited on 7/23/18 at 3:34 pm
Posted on 7/23/18 at 4:31 pm to hendersonshands
Merely the obvious cost of Multi-culturalism Uber Alles.
"LOOK AT ME LOOK AT ME LOOK AT ME!!! CULTURE CULTURE CULTURE!!!"
(Athlete is stupid and matches are lost followed by idiotic fan criticism.)
"RACIST! HOW DARE YOU BRING THAT UP!"
"LOOK AT ME LOOK AT ME LOOK AT ME!!! CULTURE CULTURE CULTURE!!!"
(Athlete is stupid and matches are lost followed by idiotic fan criticism.)
"RACIST! HOW DARE YOU BRING THAT UP!"
Posted on 7/23/18 at 6:36 pm to Keys Open Doors
quote:
German politicians, journalists, and even soccer administrators have valid reasons for this critique, and Ozil is nothing more than a disingenuous coward who has been coddled his whole life and can't respond to valid criticism.
You don't even know the whole situation. Yet you post this garbage as fricking fact.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 7:34 pm to dgnx6
“This garbage?” frick off.
I’ve posted more context in this thread about the meaning behind the photos (and why they are controversial at best) than you would find in media reports about the situation.
If Ozil has any racist emails, voicemails, texts or anything else from the DFB, he can post them. He isn’t being shy or private. He’s more than willing to post details about his school and Mercedes Benz on Twitter for his followers .
Yet he hasn’t posted a smoking gun. There are critiques from officials but Hoeness is about as harsh as it gets, and the only way you can interpret that as racist is if you think critiquing a German Turk for anything is racist, on its own.
I’ve posted more context in this thread about the meaning behind the photos (and why they are controversial at best) than you would find in media reports about the situation.
If Ozil has any racist emails, voicemails, texts or anything else from the DFB, he can post them. He isn’t being shy or private. He’s more than willing to post details about his school and Mercedes Benz on Twitter for his followers .
Yet he hasn’t posted a smoking gun. There are critiques from officials but Hoeness is about as harsh as it gets, and the only way you can interpret that as racist is if you think critiquing a German Turk for anything is racist, on its own.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 10:46 pm to Keys Open Doors
I agree with aspect of the photos.
I completely disagree with you calling the dude a coward when you have no idea with his dealings with the federation. And the fact that he's not the sole player on that fricking team.
I find it highly hypocritical considering they have tried to sign Ozil, and his Bayern players were the ones to fail as well. Failed to score opportunities created by Ozil.
I completely disagree with you calling the dude a coward when you have no idea with his dealings with the federation. And the fact that he's not the sole player on that fricking team.
quote:
Yet he hasn’t posted a smoking gun. There are critiques from officials but Hoeness is about as harsh as it gets, and the only way you can interpret that as racist is if you think critiquing a German Turk for anything is racist, on its own.
I find it highly hypocritical considering they have tried to sign Ozil, and his Bayern players were the ones to fail as well. Failed to score opportunities created by Ozil.
This post was edited on 7/23/18 at 10:49 pm
Posted on 7/23/18 at 11:37 pm to Bluefin
quote:
Having said that, Erdogan is obviously not held in high regard in Germany or most of Europe. I understand it’s Özil’s Turkish roots, but his “German” side should have taken over and helped him realize that a public photo with someone that many view as a tyrant would not be well-received among many Germans. I’d be upset if Frank Martin had taken a smiling, cordial photo with Fidel Castro simply because he’s Cuban-American.
Özil shouldn’t take any of the blame for Germany sucking at the WC, but I’m just saying that it probably wasn’t the best decision to play for Germany and pose for a pic with someone who calls current German politicians “Nazis”
My opinion is this. ^^
His desire to pose with Erdogan, and his true heart's motivation is his choice, and I dont judge that.
He should have had enough foresight or counsel to know that doing that would create backlash, especially if given a reason(poor performance).
He should've been ready for this reaction, not saying it's right from the DFB and German fans, but Ozil playing ignorant and victim is too much for me.
This post was edited on 7/24/18 at 1:02 am
Posted on 7/23/18 at 11:37 pm to dgnx6
quote:
I find it highly hypocritical considering they have tried to sign Ozil, and his Bayern players were the ones to fail as well. Failed to score opportunities created by Ozil.
This is a valid point and I suspect the reason why the Bayern Munich-affiliated guys aren't bagging on the Bayern players is because they don't want to lower the transfer values of Boateng, Hummels, etc. Look, Ozil can complain about being scapegoated because he is a high-profile player and playing a high-profile position. And not being part of the Bayern clique may play a role as well.
However, claiming racism when the press criticizes you for taking PR photos with Erdogan before an election and when DFB guys call you out for poor performance rings very hollow to me. It seems very clear to me that he is deflecting and trying to reframe the debate to get on more favorable territory, as his (likely) political views are approved by a single digit percentage of the German population.
Posted on 7/23/18 at 11:40 pm to Keys Open Doors
quote:
It seems very clear to me that he is deflecting and trying to reframe the debate to get on more favorable territory, as his (likely) political views are approved by a single digit percentage of the German population.

Posted on 7/24/18 at 7:36 am to dgnx6
quote:
You don't even know the whole situation. Yet you post this garbage as fricking fact.
pretty sure Keys is Turkish so I'm going to defer to his opinion on Turk-related matters
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