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A soccer board referendum on Jurgen as the US' coach
Posted on 6/25/16 at 11:51 pm
Posted on 6/25/16 at 11:51 pm
Full disclosure, Jurgen's not going anywhere until after 2018 or if we miss out on Russia, but I think we're capable of having an intelligent and respectful discussion on where we think the program currently stands after 6 years of JK.
The way I see it, everyone falls somewhere on this scale:
progression-----------------------stagnation------------------------regression
For me, I would put me near the middle at stagnation, but teetering more towards regression than progression.
I say that because, tactically, we're still playing Bob & Arena ball i.e. defend and counter against the bigger fish. And that's fine, for as good as our talent pool has gotten over the years, we're still not talented enough to go up against the Germany's & Argentina's of the world and "take it to them" as Jurgen would say. And at times, it has worked for us... it's how we got out of the group of death in 2014, and Jurgen deserves adulation for it.
But the reason I lean more towards regression that progression is that Jurgen clearly doesn't want to play that way, but knows he has to, so there's an uncertainty that comes with that and the team, at times, plays like it's uncertain (2015 Gold Cup, vs. Argentina in the Copa).
The way I see it, everyone falls somewhere on this scale:
progression-----------------------stagnation------------------------regression
For me, I would put me near the middle at stagnation, but teetering more towards regression than progression.
I say that because, tactically, we're still playing Bob & Arena ball i.e. defend and counter against the bigger fish. And that's fine, for as good as our talent pool has gotten over the years, we're still not talented enough to go up against the Germany's & Argentina's of the world and "take it to them" as Jurgen would say. And at times, it has worked for us... it's how we got out of the group of death in 2014, and Jurgen deserves adulation for it.
But the reason I lean more towards regression that progression is that Jurgen clearly doesn't want to play that way, but knows he has to, so there's an uncertainty that comes with that and the team, at times, plays like it's uncertain (2015 Gold Cup, vs. Argentina in the Copa).
11
Posted on 6/25/16 at 11:56 pm to Broski
I would go with stagnation can't say regression until the old guard is gone.
Posted on 6/25/16 at 11:57 pm to Dizz
quote:
can't say regression until the old guard is gone.
Why not?
Posted on 6/25/16 at 11:58 pm to Broski
(no message)
This post was edited on 10/8/25 at 11:04 pm
Posted on 6/26/16 at 12:01 am to Broski
Part of his big selling point was to reengineer the development system. I want to see how his players step into those spots. I may be wrong that it will take a few more years for that change to show.
Posted on 6/26/16 at 12:03 am to Dizz
quote:
Part of his big selling point was to reengineer the development system. I want to see how his players step into those spots. I may be wrong that it will take a few more years for that change to show.
That process will take longer than 2 world cup cycles... Any true youth development change that he has made won't bear fruit under his tenure as coach.
Posted on 6/26/16 at 12:16 am to Broski
I like him. there is no talent here. He is doing well
Posted on 6/26/16 at 12:19 am to Andy Bernard
quote:
He is doing well
In what regards?
Posted on 6/26/16 at 12:45 am to Andy Bernard
quote:
I like him. there is no talent here. He is doing well
Posted on 6/26/16 at 5:36 am to Broski
Stagnation because our core squad is not that good, but progression with the youth academy structure (it will take a generation to bear fruit).
Posted on 6/26/16 at 6:50 am to EastNastySwag
I'll go with stagnation trending towards regression.
I just can't for the life of me understand why he isn't trying to give up and comers a chance. We trot out Beckerdreads and Wondo in a crucial match against Argentina...WHY!? There is no chance Becks or Wondo will be around in 2018, and they're not even good now. We are not improving our national team because we are still playing 30+ year olds that will not (or should not) be there in Russia, so we are not getting even slightly better.
I just can't for the life of me understand why he isn't trying to give up and comers a chance. We trot out Beckerdreads and Wondo in a crucial match against Argentina...WHY!? There is no chance Becks or Wondo will be around in 2018, and they're not even good now. We are not improving our national team because we are still playing 30+ year olds that will not (or should not) be there in Russia, so we are not getting even slightly better.
Posted on 6/26/16 at 6:56 am to Broski
On the "progression" side of stagnation by one click.
Posted on 6/26/16 at 7:23 am to Broski
Best way I can sum it up as is growing pains. B/C US Soccer is in a transition period with expectations always rising, the popularity of the sport rising along with changing in how we develop youth players.
Tactics wise Jurgy is Bi-Polar. When he gets them right he is spot on but when he gets them wrong is fricking awful.
If he stays on as a technical director working with the youth sides and youth development across the country he will excel.
We will probably see the fruits of these growing pains in another 10 years or so.
Tactics wise Jurgy is Bi-Polar. When he gets them right he is spot on but when he gets them wrong is fricking awful.
If he stays on as a technical director working with the youth sides and youth development across the country he will excel.
We will probably see the fruits of these growing pains in another 10 years or so.
Posted on 6/26/16 at 7:26 am to Broski
I'd put him on the side of regression.
Someone posted a pic of his results against top ten teams vs those of Bob/Arenas/Sampson.
They were 5-15-1 while he is 0-5-1.
That's regression.
He has also let his ego get in the way of player pool call-ups (Landy/Benny). You can't have that.
Also, he continues to play players out of position, and that does not develop a system of cohesiveness.
And, he never takes credit for losses, as he will throw his players under the bus after poor performances.
Lastly, the guys lack of tactics are well documented. The Argentina game is the lasted example of how he is under or ill-prepared.
Someone posted a pic of his results against top ten teams vs those of Bob/Arenas/Sampson.
They were 5-15-1 while he is 0-5-1.
That's regression.
He has also let his ego get in the way of player pool call-ups (Landy/Benny). You can't have that.
Also, he continues to play players out of position, and that does not develop a system of cohesiveness.
And, he never takes credit for losses, as he will throw his players under the bus after poor performances.
Lastly, the guys lack of tactics are well documented. The Argentina game is the lasted example of how he is under or ill-prepared.
Posted on 6/26/16 at 7:28 am to BamaCoaster
quote:
The Argentina game is the lasted example of how he is under or ill-prepared.
To be fair, it wouldn't matter what our tactics were vs them
Posted on 6/26/16 at 7:43 am to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
To be fair, it wouldn't matter what our tactics were vs them
We would have lost the game, no doubt.
But, how many matches have you watched where a team did not get one shot on target? That's unacceptable.
Posted on 6/26/16 at 7:44 am to BamaCoaster
quote:
But, how many matches have you watched where a team did not get one shot on target? That's unacceptable.
Croatia and Portugal didn't have a shot on target until ET yesterday
Posted on 6/26/16 at 7:51 am to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
Croatia and Portugal didn't have a shot on target until ET yesterday
Posted on 6/26/16 at 7:56 am to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
To be fair, it wouldn't matter what our tactics were vs them
That's horseshite.
Organize defensively, bunker, counter, try to nick a goal off of a set piece is how you get points off a superior team. It's how shitty teams like Guatemala, Panama and Jamaica get points off of us.
We did none of those things.
That's probably Graham Zusi or Brad Guzan's fault, though.
Posted on 6/26/16 at 8:01 am to Broski
quote:
He is doing well
In what regards?
I mean we had a good tournament here. We lost to the #1 and #3 teams in the world. Colombia may not really be a top 5 team but Argentina certainly is. We were likely the better team last night overall, or at least even (I think we were even with them both games for the record). Argentina is way better than us.
The younger guys who have come up have shown out well, and are thankfully playing over in Europe to really develop. We have a good core of guys if we take those 5-6 (brooks, wood, johnson, Pulisic, Yedlin) we can see a good group for 2016 and beyond. All of those guys probably have 2 more WCs in them age wise. Too often I feel like the USA has never been young enough to build on one good tournament but think we are trending that way now, to where we could be good by 2022, with talent we have already seen play at a high level on the team today
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