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re: PC Discussion - Gaming, Performance and Enthusiasts
Posted on 10/7/23 at 12:42 pm to hoojy
Posted on 10/7/23 at 12:42 pm to hoojy
quote:
Both. It would be a weird place. At the 4080 price, you have to lower the price of the 4080, or it won't sell.
The performance gap between the 4080 and 4090 is larger than the gap between the 4070ti and the 4080. And yet, the 4070ti can currently be had for $800, the 4080 at $1,200, and the 4090 at $1,600. We may not see it, but I don't think it would be outlandish to drop the 4080 to $1,000 and slot in the 4080ti at $1,200. They would all still be overpriced compared to previous generations, but the performance stack would actually make more sense than it does now.
1
Posted on 10/7/23 at 12:46 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
with it being tied to FSR upscaling,
Um... I'm pretty sure that's FUD. I've seen some videos where you can disable FSR and still use FG. Although, I'm sure not sure if it's HYPER-X or FSR 3. frick these names.
quote:
Frame gen is already a niche application.
Correct. I turned it on cyberpunk and immediately turned it off. Your hand and eyes are telling your brain 2 different things. Frame generation isn't free performance, in fact, it's the opposite. It's a graphics feature.
Edit: bolded for mt.
That and added sure. 
This post was edited on 10/7/23 at 12:51 pm
Posted on 10/7/23 at 12:49 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
The performance gap between the 4080 and 4090 is larger than the gap between the 4070ti and the 4080. And yet, the 4070ti can currently be had for $800, the 4080 at $1,200, and the 4090 at $1,600. We may not see it, but I don't think it would be outlandish to drop the 4080 to $1,000 and slot in the 4080ti at $1,200. They would all still be overpriced compared to previous generations, but the performance stack would actually make more sense than it does now.
I can see that happening later next year. Can't see it happening right now with the TSMC production lag. I would love to be wrong tho. Hell, I'm probably wrong over half the time...so...
Posted on 10/7/23 at 1:39 pm to hoojy
quote:
Um... I'm pretty sure that's FUD. I've seen some videos where you can disable FSR and still use FG. Although, I'm sure not sure if it's HYPER-X or FSR 3. frick these names.
I haven't personally tested it, but both videos I've watched as well as the TechPowerup review I linked previously say that you can't have frame gen without turning on upscaling. Quote from the article:
quote:
Speaking of image quality, it is important to note that in order to use AMD's Frame Generation solution, the Super Resolution upscaling component is required. Unfortunately, the image quality of the Super Resolution component isn't improved with the third version of FSR, and the game is still essentially using FSR 2 for upscaling, which, as we have tested numerous times, has major instabilities in motion, especially at lower resolutions.
Posted on 10/7/23 at 1:46 pm to Joshjrn
That's pretty shitty if true. Hell, you can use FG without DLSS. It might be that hyper-x shite, I guess. 
And that shite is pure rubbish in action games.
At least so far.
And that shite is pure rubbish in action games.
At least so far.
Posted on 10/7/23 at 1:51 pm to hoojy
Yep. That's been my sticking point since before I started getting insulted for no fricking reason
AMD appears to have done just fine for a first attempt at a software based frame gen solution. It has a host of problems, but they are all fixable. But as long as AMD frame gen requires the use of AMD upscaling, a lot of people who would otherwise use it, aren't going to. Just not worth giving up either native or DLSS in order to use AMD frame gen, at least for most people.
AMD appears to have done just fine for a first attempt at a software based frame gen solution. It has a host of problems, but they are all fixable. But as long as AMD frame gen requires the use of AMD upscaling, a lot of people who would otherwise use it, aren't going to. Just not worth giving up either native or DLSS in order to use AMD frame gen, at least for most people.
Posted on 10/7/23 at 1:54 pm to Joshjrn
Their lack of will to do high-end(according to rumors) is probably the telling factor that RDNA is being ole yellered after this next gen of cards. At least, I hope.
This post was edited on 10/7/23 at 1:56 pm
Posted on 10/8/23 at 7:22 am to hoojy
quote:
I can see that happening later next year. Can't see it happening right now with the TSMC production lag. I would love to be wrong tho. Hell, I'm probably wrong over half the time...so...
To go back to this, I think if they wait any longer than Q124, it just becomes DOA unless they bottom out the price. Assuming the rumor is true, my working theory is that they have been sitting on these chips for a while. As a reminder, for the 30 series, both the 3080 and 3090 used the 102 die. For the 40 series, the 4090 uses 102 but the 4080 is relegated to 103, meaning the current 4090 is the only gaming card using the 102 die. I know some of the professional cards use 102, but I think they use a different node size. So, to the best of my knowledge, which I admit is very low level, the 4090 is the only card using its specific chip and process. So any 4090 chips produced that were mostly fine but didn't quite meet the base spec count for the 4090 would just be sitting around with no use.
Assuming all of that is true, which I acknowledge may not be, it's not a question of shifting production to the 4080ti. It's simply rebranding slightly "defective" 4090 chips as 4080ti. Which, as a reminder, is exactly what they did from jump with the 3090/3080 last gen. They can further cut down on the BOM by packaging it with less VRAM, increasing margin on an otherwise "useless" bit of silicon.
This post was edited on 10/8/23 at 7:24 am
Posted on 10/10/23 at 1:23 pm to Joshjrn
Ya, I get that it's the rejected 4090's.
If their MO stays the same, it would be maybe a few months before Blackwell is released. Doesn't make too much sense to do otherwise.
If they do release early 2024, either they're going ahead with Blackwell 6 months later or they're gonna do another refresh. Another refresh will look bad on them unless they delay it(blackwell) until 2025. Turing supers anyone?
If their MO stays the same, it would be maybe a few months before Blackwell is released. Doesn't make too much sense to do otherwise.
If they do release early 2024, either they're going ahead with Blackwell 6 months later or they're gonna do another refresh. Another refresh will look bad on them unless they delay it(blackwell) until 2025. Turing supers anyone?
This post was edited on 10/10/23 at 1:32 pm
Posted on 10/12/23 at 10:07 am to Joshjrn
If any of you BR folks, or people around BR, want something from Microcenter, I'm going there this weekend 
Posted on 10/12/23 at 10:15 am to bluebarracuda
quote:
If any of you BR folks, or people around BR, want something from Microcenter, I'm going there this weekend
Im not in the BR area or need anything, but this might be the biggest bro move I have seen from anyone on TD.
Posted on 10/21/23 at 10:39 am to LSUGent
I just ordered me an upgrade this week.
My current rig is 5 or so years old.
ASROCK Z370 pro 4
Intel i5 8600K
16GB 3200mhz DDR4 G.Skill Trident Z
Corsair CX750 PSU
Asus Nvidia GEFORCE GTX 1060 6GB
500GB SSD
Corsair H60 H2O CPU Cooler
This is what I ordered
Intel® Core™ i7-13700KF
32 GB [16 GB X2] DDR5-6000MHz
RTX 4070
MSI PRO Z790-P WiFi
1000 Watt - CORSAIR RM1000e
2TB Samsung 990 PRO M.2
My current rig is 5 or so years old.
ASROCK Z370 pro 4
Intel i5 8600K
16GB 3200mhz DDR4 G.Skill Trident Z
Corsair CX750 PSU
Asus Nvidia GEFORCE GTX 1060 6GB
500GB SSD
Corsair H60 H2O CPU Cooler
This is what I ordered
Intel® Core™ i7-13700KF
32 GB [16 GB X2] DDR5-6000MHz
RTX 4070
MSI PRO Z790-P WiFi
1000 Watt - CORSAIR RM1000e
2TB Samsung 990 PRO M.2
Posted on 10/21/23 at 1:41 pm to King
Really just need to know how much Id save building the exact same as the link, or if anyone knows about these tridents and the cooling system being worth the extra price.
MSI MEG Trident X2 13NUI-001USfor 4700? How much would I save building this myself?
Intel Core i9-13900KF 24-Core (13th Gen)
64GB of 4800 MHz DDR5 RAM
NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4090 (24GB GDDR6X)
2TB PCIe 4.0 M.2 SSD
2.5Gb Ethernet Port | 1Gb Ethernet Port
Wi-Fi 6E (802.11ax) | Bluetooth 5.2
USB 3.2 Gen 1 & Gen 2 | USB 2.0
USB Gaming Keyboard & Mouse Included
Windows 11 Home (64-Bit)
If I do buy who would you trust the most to buy from?
Honestly with cooling being so important and having o ly built 1 rig myself... With such high end parts I'm not sure i would want to build it
nearly same build, normal tower, 1k less 4k with 3 year warranty
2nd edit:
Told my kid he would get his first rig for christmas, so rather than replacing my rig in the next few years anyway... I will just give him mine with 32 DDR4, 3TB of storage and a 3060ti.
other option would be buy him something black friday for around 1500 and wind up spending to overhaul/replace mine anyway later
I have an extra monitor and extra M/KB for him so I wont need new peripherals if i give him mine.
MSI MEG Trident X2 13NUI-001USfor 4700? How much would I save building this myself?
Intel Core i9-13900KF 24-Core (13th Gen)
64GB of 4800 MHz DDR5 RAM
NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4090 (24GB GDDR6X)
2TB PCIe 4.0 M.2 SSD
2.5Gb Ethernet Port | 1Gb Ethernet Port
Wi-Fi 6E (802.11ax) | Bluetooth 5.2
USB 3.2 Gen 1 & Gen 2 | USB 2.0
USB Gaming Keyboard & Mouse Included
Windows 11 Home (64-Bit)
If I do buy who would you trust the most to buy from?
Honestly with cooling being so important and having o ly built 1 rig myself... With such high end parts I'm not sure i would want to build it
nearly same build, normal tower, 1k less 4k with 3 year warranty
2nd edit:
Told my kid he would get his first rig for christmas, so rather than replacing my rig in the next few years anyway... I will just give him mine with 32 DDR4, 3TB of storage and a 3060ti.
other option would be buy him something black friday for around 1500 and wind up spending to overhaul/replace mine anyway later
I have an extra monitor and extra M/KB for him so I wont need new peripherals if i give him mine.
This post was edited on 10/21/23 at 2:40 pm
Posted on 10/21/23 at 3:19 pm to Gusoline
Why would you ever buy a dead platform Intel cpu? 
Posted on 10/21/23 at 3:43 pm to UltimateHog
quote:
Why would you ever buy a dead platform Intel cpu?
i dont know... that's why i asked first... thanks for the "help"
Posted on 10/21/23 at 3:51 pm to Gusoline
If you don't plan on upgrading anytime in the near future, don't worry about buying a "dead" platform.
I would go with the 12900k build from Amazon over the 13th gen one you posted.
12900k build has faster RAM and more storage
I would go with the 12900k build from Amazon over the 13th gen one you posted.
12900k build has faster RAM and more storage
Posted on 10/21/23 at 3:58 pm to Gusoline
quote:don't worry it's just his stock position he's concerned about, not actually helping people
thanks for the "help"
Posted on 10/21/23 at 4:01 pm to bluebarracuda
i posted the wrong link. apologies.
13900 but smaller ssd and cheaper still. some of the reviews of the shipper complain about long ship times
13900 but smaller ssd and cheaper still. some of the reviews of the shipper complain about long ship times
This post was edited on 10/21/23 at 4:03 pm
Posted on 10/21/23 at 4:07 pm to Gusoline
Yeah don't ever go dead platform unless it's more performance in this case it isn't.
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