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Message
re: Tariffs cost states $200 billion
Posted on 2/11/26 at 11:08 am to frogtown
Posted on 2/11/26 at 11:08 am to frogtown
Im glad he does. You want free trade. Let's free trade and stop creating advantages that put the US at a disadvantage.
You want to do that. Then we will handle business.
Tariffs are not some evil thing that is new. Tariffs are not democrat or republican. They are a nessasary tool.
You want to do that. Then we will handle business.
Tariffs are not some evil thing that is new. Tariffs are not democrat or republican. They are a nessasary tool.
0
Posted on 2/11/26 at 11:36 am to frankthetank
quote:
I remember when the press and liberals were OK with the transitive price increases
And paying Americans more.
Posted on 2/11/26 at 12:00 pm to KWL85
Only a moron would have expected all prices to go back to pre-COVID levels just because of who was elected President. Hell, we could put 535 “MAGA” Reps and Senators in Congress to join President Trump, and prices for majority of goods and services still wouldn’t go back to pre-2020 levels without an economic crash to cause it.
Posted on 2/11/26 at 12:45 pm to Jax-Tiger
quote:
I don't understand why Trump is catching shite on this. Prices have NOT skyrocketed, as people have said, and all Trump is doing is looking at inequalities built into the system and trying to level the playing field.
You have failed to read the room.
Prices have went up. This comes just after the hit American consumers took from COVID inflation. Consumers are tired of it. They want it to stop.
quote:
People who benefited from the old system don't like it.
Who is benefitting the Trump system of personally being involved in every deal and doing special carve outs? I don't need to tell you it will be those in government. Use your head here.
Posted on 2/11/26 at 9:31 pm to frogtown
quote:
Consumers are tired of it. They want it to stop.
Yet they voted for Tump.
See your issue?
The fact is Trump is doing what is best for the USA citizen over all. Prices have NOT skyrocketed.
From 1914 to 2025, the average annual U.S. inflation rate (measured by CPI) has been approximately 3.29%.
In short, consumer prices have risen more slowly than the long-term historical norm.
The tariff scare is not happening the way you demand it. So in “normal” times 2–3% inflation is typical. Prices gradually rise each year. Inflation has cooled significantly. About 2.7% year-over-year in late 2025. Forecast around 2.5% in early 2026.
Posted on 2/12/26 at 6:49 am to bigjoe1
quote:I get that some folks are so naive as to presume trade deficits do not matter. I get that others are so self-interested that they'd prefer to inventory cheap foreign goods even at the expense of a greater national good. Those mentalities drive articles like the OP.
Tariffs cost states $200 billion
But surely this board understands the nature and effect of our Federal revenue-spending mismatch? Surely this board understands the nature and effect of our National Debt?
Representatives of the very states cited in the OP refuse to touch Federal spending. They won't cut 1¢ of spending. Meanwhile, their constituents viscerally oppose further income taxation. So Congress just continues to run gigantic deficits with no end in sight. In that environment. Tariffs are both a direct and indirect (reshoring) revenue source, and are offset to some extent by foreign markets.
So given consistent angst about the value of tariff revenues, the question an honest broker should ask is how much do Federal Budget deficits and the National Debt cost those same states in the long run?
At a US debt of $40T, cost-of-carry is an easy calculation. Every 1% adds $400B to the national budget/deficit. As we distance ourselves from the ZIRP years, and shift back to historically normal rates, the math will grow increasingly ugly.
Now then, what is the beef with tariff revenue under these circumstances?
Posted on 2/12/26 at 7:33 am to Jax-Tiger
quote:
A lot of people are saying that AI is going to reduce the number of jobs in the US. That has to be offset, somewhere, so Trump is seeking to add more manufacturing jobs and deport cheap illegal labor. I like the strategy.
As an American manufacturer, as I expand, I look at every way possible to add machines and compute power without adding people. People are a headache, and technology allows me to bypass that headache.
Posted on 2/12/26 at 8:34 am to Jax-Tiger
quote:
I guess the bottom line is whether you would rather ship all of our manufacturing overseas in order to get the prices down or would you rather pay a little extra and make more things here in the US?
I think most people would prefer the latter.
Disagree. The majority like the sound of made in America, but want someone else to pay for it. The majority of consumers are price driven. When they have a choice of similar quality items, they choose the lower cost one.
Posted on 2/12/26 at 10:39 am to frogtown
quote:
Prices have went up. This comes just after the hit American consumers took from COVID inflation. Consumers are tired of it. They want it to stop.
Nobody expects prices to go DOWN. Just like they don't expect to earn the same amount of money next year as they earn this year. What people want is for the rate of inflation to go down. That is happening. They also want wages to go up more than inflation does. That is also happening. It did not under the Biden administration.
Inflation is lower. You can take some things, like gas, and see that they are lower than they were a year ago. Other things may be much higher, like beef. Overall, things are slightly higher, as to be expected. Nobody wants negative inflation.
quote:
Who is benefitting the Trump system of personally being involved in every deal and doing special carve outs? I don't need to tell you it will be those in government. Use your head here.
There are always carveouts. Nothing new here. What Trump is trying to eliminate is trade agreements that go against the interest of the US, foreign aid giveaways, policies that encourage US companies to manufacture goods overseas, and wasteful domestic programs. All of the money that gets wasted ends up in somebody's pocket. We need to look at all of that and ask questions.
Trump is a businessman. In business, a good deal is one that benefits BOTH sides of the agreement. We have two many instances where we have deals, programs, policies, etc, that benefit only one side, and it is not the United States. Why? Is there any reason other than corruption? Stupidity, maybe? Anti-American sentiment? What is it?
Posted on 2/12/26 at 11:16 am to Jax-Tiger
Trump went after the tariffs aggressively. He deported people aggressively - people don't even talk about the self deportations that occurred because of his policies. He went after lowering drug costs aggressively. He aggressively pursued lower gas prices. In doing so, he created a lot of churn. His poll numbers are lower.
He understands we have another 8 months before people have to make up their minds on who to vote for. All of his policies are causing short term churn and should give a long term gain.
By the time the election comes:
1.) Our deficit should be down because of tariffs and increased tax revenue due to more manufacturing in the US
2.) Wages should be up because of more manufacturing jobs and less cheap, illegal labor
3.) Inflation will be a mixed bag because energy costs will be down, tariffs up, wages up, drug costs down
At any rate, Trump is envisioning an economy that is better for America, especially if we can make a serious dent in the deficit (which is down 21% year over year).
He understands we have another 8 months before people have to make up their minds on who to vote for. All of his policies are causing short term churn and should give a long term gain.
By the time the election comes:
1.) Our deficit should be down because of tariffs and increased tax revenue due to more manufacturing in the US
2.) Wages should be up because of more manufacturing jobs and less cheap, illegal labor
3.) Inflation will be a mixed bag because energy costs will be down, tariffs up, wages up, drug costs down
At any rate, Trump is envisioning an economy that is better for America, especially if we can make a serious dent in the deficit (which is down 21% year over year).
Posted on 2/12/26 at 11:45 am to KWL85
quote:
Disagree. The majority like the sound of made in America, but want someone else to pay for it. The majority of consumers are price driven. When they have a choice of similar quality items, they choose the lower cost one.
Most people don't think about things like child labor, unemployed American workers, or even where their medicine, electronics, or furniture comes from. I think if they did, they would prefer to buy American. That is just my opinion. I think that people tend to buy the cheap stuff when they don't think about it. Not everyone, but most.
That's why I like tariffs. Maybe the cost of widgets will go up a bit, but maybe that also makes the Made In America product the most affordable.
Back when we made more products in America, people cared about it. Nowadays, they don't, because most things are made overseas, now, and many types of products don't have an American option. We need to change that, to the extent that we can. I just don't think being a consumer driven economy without making anything is sustainable.
This post was edited on 2/12/26 at 11:55 am
Posted on 2/12/26 at 11:50 am to BottomlandBrew
quote:
As an American manufacturer, as I expand, I look at every way possible to add machines and compute power without adding people. People are a headache, and technology allows me to bypass that headache.
I don't have any problem with that, but I don't want you to have the option of hiring an illegal alien at $12 an hour for the employees you do hire. I want you to hire people who are here legally and pay them the market wage and keep costs down with automation, computers, and AI.
The illegal immigrant population is dwindling, the baby boomers are retiring, and more manufacturing jobs are coming to the US. We will need more automation.
Posted on 2/12/26 at 3:01 pm to Jax-Tiger
quote:
Nobody expects prices to go DOWN. Just like they don't expect to earn the same amount of money next year as they earn this year. What people want is for the rate of inflation to go down. That is happening. They also want wages to go up more than inflation does. That is also happening. It did not under the Biden administration.
Inflation is lower. You can take some things, like gas, and see that they are lower than they were a year ago. Other things may be much higher, like beef. Overall, things are slightly higher, as to be expected. Nobody wants negative inflation.
An increase in price and inflation are different things. I am talking about a price increase, not inflation. So you can forget about the inflation argument.
quote:
There are always carveouts. Nothing new here
The effective tariff rate was 2% to 3% in 2024. Now it is around 15% I believe.
Carve outs didn't matter much before because the rate was so low. Now they do.
If you don't think these "carve outs" won't be used to enrich those in Government, well, I don't know what to tell you.
This post was edited on 2/12/26 at 3:05 pm
Posted on 2/12/26 at 3:16 pm to BottomlandBrew
quote:
As an American manufacturer, as I expand, I look at every way possible to add machines and compute power without adding people. People are a headache, and technology allows me to bypass that headache.
Interesting take. My question is who will be able to purchase your products? I mean.. machines and compute power replaces people. People purchase... not machines. If they have no jobs.... YOU have no business.
So continue down this path and we get either a massive reset from a massive economic crash or we get universal income.
I suspect universal income will be tried first. Guess where that money is going to come from? Businesses like yours.
Posted on 2/12/26 at 3:57 pm to frogtown
quote:
The effective tariff rate was 2% to 3% in 2024. Now it is around 15% I believe.
And as pointed out, prices have not gone up more than normal.
You have lost the argument Frog
Posted on 2/12/26 at 4:02 pm to Jjdoc
quote:
And as pointed out, prices have not gone up more than normal.
You have lost the argument Frog
We are talking about "carves out".
Posted on 2/12/26 at 5:01 pm to frogtown
quote:
Prices have went up.
"Have prices went up" as much as "prices had went up" prior to Liberation Day?
Posted on 2/12/26 at 5:03 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
Have prices went up" as much as "prices had went up" prior to Liberation Day?
WTF are you talking about?
Posted on 2/12/26 at 5:08 pm to frogtown
quote:Seems pretty straightforward. Have "prices went up" as much as "prices had went up" prior to Liberation Day?
WTF are you talking about?
Do you know what "Liberation Day" is?
This post was edited on 2/12/26 at 5:11 pm
Posted on 2/12/26 at 5:09 pm to NC_Tigah
quote:
Seems pretty straightforward. Have prices went up" as much as "prices had went up" prior to Liberation Day?
What is your measure? We are talking about import prices BTW.
This post was edited on 2/12/26 at 5:11 pm
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