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Started By
Message
Please explain this to me like I'm an idiot (scope ring/rail related)
Posted on 12/31/25 at 7:37 am
Posted on 12/31/25 at 7:37 am
Because I am an idiot.
Recently purchased a Bergara Wilderness Sierra in 308 and a Leupold Mark 4 (30 mil of adjustment range) scope. I'm trying to decide if I need a 20 MOA rail or not.
As far as hunting goes I can't see myself taking shots over 300 yards. We do have a powerline set up with targets/steel and often play around with 800+ yard shots for shits and giggles. I'd like to start target shooting more since I enjoy the hell out of it.
I was browsing Hawkins Precision's website and noticed that they have 25 MOA rings that don't require using a rail. Would this mess me up at closer ranges or not be as reliable as a one piece rail set up? If 25 MOA is 7.27 mils, should have enough adjustment with the scope to zero at 100 yards no problem, right?
https://hawkinsprecision.com/product/long-range-hybrid-rings/
If I go with the 0 or 20 MOA rail I'll probably go with these rings.
rpmflg.com
I don't want to cheap out on my scope mount but I also don't want to spend Spuhr money on it if I can avoid it. I figure there are probably a lot of damn good rings/bases in between Monstrum and Spuhr.
Recently purchased a Bergara Wilderness Sierra in 308 and a Leupold Mark 4 (30 mil of adjustment range) scope. I'm trying to decide if I need a 20 MOA rail or not.
As far as hunting goes I can't see myself taking shots over 300 yards. We do have a powerline set up with targets/steel and often play around with 800+ yard shots for shits and giggles. I'd like to start target shooting more since I enjoy the hell out of it.
I was browsing Hawkins Precision's website and noticed that they have 25 MOA rings that don't require using a rail. Would this mess me up at closer ranges or not be as reliable as a one piece rail set up? If 25 MOA is 7.27 mils, should have enough adjustment with the scope to zero at 100 yards no problem, right?
https://hawkinsprecision.com/product/long-range-hybrid-rings/
If I go with the 0 or 20 MOA rail I'll probably go with these rings.
rpmflg.com
I don't want to cheap out on my scope mount but I also don't want to spend Spuhr money on it if I can avoid it. I figure there are probably a lot of damn good rings/bases in between Monstrum and Spuhr.
5
Posted on 12/31/25 at 8:09 am to Loup
quote:
Bergara Wilderness Sierra in 308
quote:
Leupold Mark 4 (30 mil of adjustment range) scope
quote:
decide if I need a 20 MOA rail
quote:
I can't see myself taking shots over 300 yards
No
Minute of Angle is 1 inch at 100 yards. At 300 yards it's 3 inches. You don't need an extra 20 MOA.
Posted on 12/31/25 at 8:18 am to TheBoo
quote:
Minute of Angle is 1 inch at 100 yards. At 300 yards it's 3 inches. You don't need an extra 20 MOA.
even when target shooting a close to 1k? I know I don't need it for hunting, was just wondering if it'd limit me when I'm having fun with it.
Posted on 12/31/25 at 8:23 am to Loup
quote:
As far as hunting goes I can't see myself taking shots over 300 yards. We do have a powerline set up with targets/steel and often play around with 800+ yard shots for shits and giggles. I'd like to start target shooting more since I enjoy the hell out of it.
You likely would never realize the benefit for your hunting purposes.
For target shooting, it will keep your adjustments in the middle and not at the extremes.
For all intents and purposes, there is no reason not to do a 20moa base and regular rings. I dont think the 25moa rings are necessary for your purpose unless you already own a 0 moa base.
Posted on 12/31/25 at 8:27 am to Loup
If you are shooting 1000 yards with a .308 you'll probably need more.
Posted on 12/31/25 at 8:28 am to Loup
You need to get a good ballistic app and learn how to use it anyway so start there.
Etaa: dont use those numbers. Hornady 4dof sucks. I use strelock but its on my old phone which isnt with me. fricking thing had the bullet weight at 65 grains.
You need 11-ish mils.
Etaa: dont use those numbers. Hornady 4dof sucks. I use strelock but its on my old phone which isnt with me. fricking thing had the bullet weight at 65 grains.
You need 11-ish mils.
This post was edited on 12/31/25 at 8:41 am
Posted on 12/31/25 at 8:31 am to Loup
quote:
Leupold Mark 4
Which scope and reticle do you have?
Posted on 12/31/25 at 8:36 am to kengel2
quote:
Which scope and reticle do you have?
Leupold MK4-HD 6-24x52 PR3 Mil Reticle. I wanted the 4.5x18 but got a deal on this one (used) that I couldn't pass up.
Posted on 12/31/25 at 8:50 am to Loup
No worries, I just wanted to see the reticle. You also have 14 mils of elevation in your reticle, so you can hold that extra elevation if you want. Only problem would be with the windage at that point, theres no reference for windage in that reticle, if you are holding elevation. Thats where a Christmas tree type helps.
Posted on 12/31/25 at 8:58 am to DownshiftAndFloorIt
quote:
You need to get a good ballistic app and learn how to use it anyway so start there.
I use the applied ballistics app for my muzzleloader. Just haven't plugged a 308 into it yet. I'll do that now. I know a big reason a lot of folks use the 20/25 moa rails is so that they're crosshair is closer to the center of the scope at range and a clearer picture. Didn't know if it'd be noticeable at close range or not if I go that route.
This post was edited on 12/31/25 at 9:03 am
Posted on 12/31/25 at 9:30 am to Loup
Id get a 0 rail and just crank it for long range. Set it up for your normal hunting situation. Playing around at 800 yards it won't really matter if you lose a little clarity or whatever. Itll easily get there with a 0 rail.
AB is a good one. Repeat: hirnady 4dof sucks.
AB is a good one. Repeat: hirnady 4dof sucks.
This post was edited on 12/31/25 at 9:31 am
Posted on 12/31/25 at 9:39 am to DownshiftAndFloorIt
quote:
AB is a good one. Repeat: hirnady 4dof sucks
Was it a glitch in the app?
I have the hornady app and have all my rifles profiles set up in it and never have had an issue.
Helped a buddy set up at rifle for a trip out west and we used hornady for his and one of his buddies swore the hornady was junk so he bought AB. At 700 yards it was like a .25 MOA difference or something like that
Posted on 12/31/25 at 9:45 am to Ol boy
No, the user interface just sucks.
Posted on 12/31/25 at 3:14 pm to kengel2
With a x52, I think you would want the extra moa because you will have to mount the scope with very high mounts
Posted on 12/31/25 at 4:04 pm to hophead
No disadvantage in having the 20 moa rail.
Posted on 12/31/25 at 5:53 pm to Ol boy
quote:
At 700 yards it was like a .25 MOA difference or something like that
That is an insignificant difference for dope at 700yds.
Posted on 1/2/26 at 11:40 am to Loup
If it were me, assuming you’re either target shooting or hunting I’d zero at 100 yards for hunting and then when target shooting time rolls around re-zero at 3 or 400 yards and then switch back for hunting.
I wouldn’t mess with the higher rail.
I wouldn’t mess with the higher rail.
Posted on 1/3/26 at 8:50 am to Mid Iowa Tiger
quote:
I wouldn’t mess with the higher rail.
It's not a higher rail. It's a slightly canted rail. Like another poster suggested, there's really no disadvantage to having one. You'll lose some ability adjust the scope down, but I've never once done that. Even if I'm shooting under 100 yards that I'm sighted in at, the 1.xx" difference doesn't matter in hunting and is easily accounted for with holding a point on the reticle. It does however give you 20 more MOA when adjusting up. You may or may not ever use it....but it will not ever hurt you to have it.
Posted on 1/3/26 at 9:23 am to Jon A thon
I have 20 moa rails on several of my rifles. There is no disadvantage to having it.
This post was edited on 1/3/26 at 10:04 am
Posted on 1/3/26 at 9:32 am to Jon A thon
quote:
It's not a higher rail.
I didn't mean higher as in tall. I have one on my hunting rifle, but I am also using that rifle for shots out to 800 yards or so, hunting and 2 miles when target shooting.
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