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Started By
Message
re: Lonzo shutting you mfkers up.,
Posted on 12/31/19 at 2:28 pm to P bean
Posted on 12/31/19 at 2:28 pm to P bean
You’re citing stats but telling me to watch the games 
Ya gotta be trolling at this point
quote:
Here ya go, looks like Teddy watches games, and agreed. Moore is better on the floor. Probably a better player
Ya gotta be trolling at this point
1
Posted on 12/31/19 at 2:35 pm to GynoSandberg
Here’s ya stats
5-1 in the last 6, 4-0 since Ball was reinserted as the starter
Lonzo Ball (27.9mpg):
13.5p / 6.8r / 4.3a / 1.5s
42% fg / 44% 3p / 54% efg / 53% ts
When Etwaun can help carry the team to a string of victories, let me know. It’s not a knock on him he’s just merely a complimentary piece
5-1 in the last 6, 4-0 since Ball was reinserted as the starter
Lonzo Ball (27.9mpg):
13.5p / 6.8r / 4.3a / 1.5s
42% fg / 44% 3p / 54% efg / 53% ts
When Etwaun can help carry the team to a string of victories, let me know. It’s not a knock on him he’s just merely a complimentary piece
Posted on 12/31/19 at 3:08 pm to GynoSandberg
That is hilarious you think Lonzo is carrying this team to victories.
He’s without a doubt helping us win, but it’s simply b/c he isn’t playing like absolute dog shite, not b/c he’s the one leading us.
He’s without a doubt helping us win, but it’s simply b/c he isn’t playing like absolute dog shite, not b/c he’s the one leading us.
Posted on 12/31/19 at 3:30 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:
Lonzo is carrying this team to victories.
Yeah you’re gonna have to quote where I said that. I think it’s pretty obvious who is leading us
Lonzo +59 over his last 6 tho
You just said there’s very few things Lonzo does better than Moore. Can you be specific?
Posted on 12/31/19 at 3:32 pm to LSUOverEveryTeam
Man, I'd love him to prove me wrong.
Posted on 12/31/19 at 4:10 pm to GynoSandberg
quote:
You just said there’s very few things Lonzo does better than Moore. Can you be specific?
Sure.
Etwaun is a better shooter from 3, by a wide margin. I could care less about whatever stats you throw out about Lonzos shot recently.
Etwaun can actually drive to the goal and score in the half court, and does it effectively.
Etwaun has better off ball movement
Etwaun is never going to do more than he’s capable of.
Lonzo is better at leading the fast break. Etwaun is also great at finding an open area for a fast break 3.
Lonzo is a better defensive rebounder.
Lonzo is a better help side defender.
Lonzo is a better passer, but his inability to be a threat around the rim makes it much harder for him to be an effective passer in the half court.
Like I said, etwaun is better right now. Lonzos inability to do anything other than shoot catch and shoot 3s in the half court as well as his defense that isn’t that much better than Etwaun is why.
That being said, I would expect Lonzo to improve by next year and become a much much better player. It wouldn’t take much for him to be much better. Being able to defend the better guards in the league one on one at a high level, and developing a floater would make him a near all star level player, assuming his 3P% stays up and he takes less dumb threes.
Posted on 12/31/19 at 7:04 pm to TeddyPadillac
Yeh lets look at a snippet of 5 games stats instead of the whole season. LOL.
Watching games means you would know moore is playing and contributing. Stats cited show that he is.
Watching games means you would know moore is playing and contributing. Stats cited show that he is.
Posted on 12/31/19 at 7:08 pm to GynoSandberg
Etwuan has been balling the last few games through the win streak. He has played significant minutes in 4 straight, all wins. Including 25pts vs. Houston LAST GAME. Wtf????????? Lol wow, so you really dont watch huh?
Moore has more to do with the win streak then Zo imo, since the win streak coincided with Moore playing a bunch recently.
Moore has more to do with the win streak then Zo imo, since the win streak coincided with Moore playing a bunch recently.
Posted on 12/31/19 at 8:08 pm to P bean
Just watch the games my dude
Posted on 12/31/19 at 10:22 pm to GynoSandberg
Here's a good conversation on Lonzo from some of the BSS guys on twitter.
Being just a 3 and D guard could certainly be good enough, if he played good defense. I know earlier in the year he looked a step slower than his reputation so I was hoping it was just spending the summer rehabbing rather than working out. He made comments after the last game saying he finally feels healthy.
"I'm just getting my legs back," said Ball, who wasn't cleared until September from an ankle injury that ended his 2018-19 season with the Lakers. "I've been out for pretty much nine months before I got here, so I'm just trying to do what I can do to help my team out, and the defense is picking up as well."
LINK
In the last 6 games Lonzo has been a key part of the defensive turnaround. He's got the 3rd highest difference in On/Off DRtg in that time span with the DRtg being 5.3 points better. Jrue and Kenrich are the only ones having a bigger impact at 6.9 and 9.1 respectively. He doesn't have to be an Allstar to be useful, but he does need to be good on defense and not a liability on offense.
quote:
Ryan Schwan @SchwanBSS
I finally figured out who Lonzo Ball reminds me of when he's driving. Remember when Tyreke got lazy in NO and was possibly (probably) doing drugs and he lost all his athleticism and would drive, tuck the ball and throw up trash at the rim that had no hope of going in? Lonzo!
Because, guys, Lonzo can't make a layup. The best thing you are hoping for is an offensive rebound - or that he'll dump the ball off or pass out to a shooter. And you can tell he knows this. There is a reason he drives like negative seven times a game. As a lead ballhandler.
[replying to someone else]
Not at driving. If it's not in the open floor, Ball getting past the three point line is a trick or treat adventure.
I believe @FearTheBrown said this before, but if he could shed the PG rep, he could easily meet expectations as a 3 and D wing guy good in the open court.
quote:
Shamit Dua @FearTheBrown 57m
Over the past 7 games, Lonzo has driven the ball 45 times (6.42 per game).
He has the following stats:
3-17 FGA (17.6%), 1-2 FTA (50%), 5 assists, 7 turnovers.
Being just a 3 and D guard could certainly be good enough, if he played good defense. I know earlier in the year he looked a step slower than his reputation so I was hoping it was just spending the summer rehabbing rather than working out. He made comments after the last game saying he finally feels healthy.
"I'm just getting my legs back," said Ball, who wasn't cleared until September from an ankle injury that ended his 2018-19 season with the Lakers. "I've been out for pretty much nine months before I got here, so I'm just trying to do what I can do to help my team out, and the defense is picking up as well."
LINK
In the last 6 games Lonzo has been a key part of the defensive turnaround. He's got the 3rd highest difference in On/Off DRtg in that time span with the DRtg being 5.3 points better. Jrue and Kenrich are the only ones having a bigger impact at 6.9 and 9.1 respectively. He doesn't have to be an Allstar to be useful, but he does need to be good on defense and not a liability on offense.
Posted on 12/31/19 at 10:37 pm to TigerinATL
That's a good observation -- Lonzo is not really a PG.
Posted on 1/1/20 at 12:25 am to TigerinATL
Mother fricker needs to learn how to finish af the rim.
Posted on 1/1/20 at 7:14 am to DeionDeion
quote:
4/80 is basically what Sabonis just got. and tbh that probably won't cut it considering Sabonis was the #11 pick & Lonzo was the #2 pick & touted as "the next Magic."
would you keep lonzo if you were offered sabonis straight up?
Zo is not the next magic.
Hes missing key pieces of magics game.
Ill take sabonis.
Posted on 1/1/20 at 7:23 am to touchdownjeebus
quote:
Mother fricker needs to learn how to finish af the rim.
im going check his ft %.
50%.
Hes a terrible ft shooter.
Needs to completely rework his shot.
Was 45% last year.
Statistically similar to 50%
Psychologically identical.
He doesnt want to get fouled.
Please let that rest in you.
Hes scared to be in the spotlight with the game on the line.
Hes a liability.
Now that hes made a few 3s trade him to whomever is in playoff hunt and needs a pg due to injury.
He is worse than shaquille who got intentionally fouling a bad ft shooter named after him.
This post was edited on 1/1/20 at 7:26 am
Posted on 1/1/20 at 3:36 pm to CelticDog
quote:
Hes scared to be in the spotlight with the game on the line.
Any evidence to back this up? Just witnessed him a few games ago shoot like 0-5 or 1-6 in the first 42 minutes of the game, and then made two huge 3s in the last 6 or so minutes
Posted on 1/1/20 at 6:07 pm to CelticDog
Y’all the same people who wanted to trade Ingram for Robert Covington before he even played a minute for us
Ball is only 22. He’s played 125 NBA games. By comparison, a guy like Ingram has played nearly 100 more. There needs to be time to develop. His 3P shooting has went from 33% to 36% on more attempts. FT% has went from 42% to 50% on slightly more attempts. The guy is working. You’re gonna have to relax and trust the process
Ball is only 22. He’s played 125 NBA games. By comparison, a guy like Ingram has played nearly 100 more. There needs to be time to develop. His 3P shooting has went from 33% to 36% on more attempts. FT% has went from 42% to 50% on slightly more attempts. The guy is working. You’re gonna have to relax and trust the process
Posted on 1/2/20 at 8:20 am to GynoSandberg
I am sure he is working lol, but he is a 6'6 guard who can't finish at the rim and takes 60% of his shots from 3. Everything is good when he shoots 7-12 from 3 but their will be many more times throughout the season where he tosses up careless 3's and misses. Maybe he improves or maybe not but this is who he is right now. There is no way this guy gets 80 million unless he just completely goes off the rest of the season, which I doubt.
Posted on 1/2/20 at 8:52 am to GynoSandberg
quote:
There needs to be time to develop
quote:
You’re gonna have to relax and trust the process
This. Everyone struggling to find some patience should go read David Epstein's book Range. Or check out any number of podcasts/interviews he's done about the book. He did one with Lowe in the preseason. He was on with Dave Chang and others.
Just because he has obvious flaws or a bad stretch doesn't necessarily mean he is doomed as an NBA player (hello, Austin Rivers). Even expert, professional basketball players are still learning how to improve.
It may not work out for Lonzo long term, but progress isn't always linear.
Posted on 1/2/20 at 9:27 am to corndeaux
The problem with Lonzo’s slow development curve is you only have one more season before you have to make a franchise altering commitment.
Realistically, if you want anything for him, you really only have til next years trade deadline to make your choice.
And I think the worrisome aspect of his growth so far is that it has mostly been stagnant besides one aspect of his game. And a lot of the talk with Lonzo is about how good he would be if he could just learn to do this list of things he has so far not shown interest/capacity in doing: better half-court facilitator, driving, floater, embracing contact at the rim, foul shooting, breaking down defenses, decision-making in the half court.
And that is really what we need out of a lead guard if we are building around Ingram/Zion/Jrue. Unless Zion becomes a super Draymond and we can just use Lonzo like a wing in the half court. But if Zion becomes super Draymond, you’d probably want a guy like Moore starting instead of Lonzo. The way Philly does it.
IDK, the more I game it out the more I think, barring a major offseason leap, the best use of him is to showcase him for a trade at the deadline next year.
Realistically, if you want anything for him, you really only have til next years trade deadline to make your choice.
And I think the worrisome aspect of his growth so far is that it has mostly been stagnant besides one aspect of his game. And a lot of the talk with Lonzo is about how good he would be if he could just learn to do this list of things he has so far not shown interest/capacity in doing: better half-court facilitator, driving, floater, embracing contact at the rim, foul shooting, breaking down defenses, decision-making in the half court.
And that is really what we need out of a lead guard if we are building around Ingram/Zion/Jrue. Unless Zion becomes a super Draymond and we can just use Lonzo like a wing in the half court. But if Zion becomes super Draymond, you’d probably want a guy like Moore starting instead of Lonzo. The way Philly does it.
IDK, the more I game it out the more I think, barring a major offseason leap, the best use of him is to showcase him for a trade at the deadline next year.
Posted on 1/2/20 at 10:47 am to Bronc
Yes, there is a time constraint. But the entire point of my post was to say that it is impossible for us to know that Lonzo is on a slow development curve.
Things might start clicking in a week or a month or 3 months. Or they might never click for him in NO. That's the nature of growth set out in that book. Progress isn't always linear, like we tend to believe. What looks like shite today could be laying the foundation for a stronger, better future.
At some point the Pels have to make a decision. We have to trust they have targets for his play in mind, probably many of the ones you listed. Most of those skills you listed are complex and take tons of reps in real game situations, along with hours of study and practice.
We have to trust that they can evaluate his growth in better, more holistic ways than the routine threads of praise or scorn based on his nightly 3pt shooting offered up here.
Things might start clicking in a week or a month or 3 months. Or they might never click for him in NO. That's the nature of growth set out in that book. Progress isn't always linear, like we tend to believe. What looks like shite today could be laying the foundation for a stronger, better future.
At some point the Pels have to make a decision. We have to trust they have targets for his play in mind, probably many of the ones you listed. Most of those skills you listed are complex and take tons of reps in real game situations, along with hours of study and practice.
We have to trust that they can evaluate his growth in better, more holistic ways than the routine threads of praise or scorn based on his nightly 3pt shooting offered up here.
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