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re: We, as a society, really dropped the ball on potential police reform
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:34 am to USMEagles
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:34 am to USMEagles
quote:
The traffic stop-based model of policing is profoundly broken and completely incompatible with a free, just society.
To the extent that someone is breaking the law, yes, there should be traffic stops.
This idea that the police are somehow the revenue collectors for the city via traffic fines has got to go, though.
0
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:35 am to Baws
quote:
They had to take lie detectors on weed. One of them didn’t get in because he didn’t pass.
They don't care if you smoked weed before, but want to make sure you are not a current user.
Your buddy lied on the polygraph if that's whey he didn't get hired.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:36 am to DiamondDog
quote:
Hey. How about you take a glock, run around the city in BR responding to every distress call, deal with your life constantly being in danger, then have some crackhead point a cell phone in your face twice a night yelling WorldStar.
Then let’s talk about “police reform”. How about criminal reform? Like don’t commit fricking crime.
Why aren't these one and the same? Or do we just stay in a catch 22 and let things keep getting worse?
OP makes a valid point, many are confused and only see cops in a bad light. If every interaction you had with a cop growing up was negative, you would not have the same viewpoint. And I don't mean actually committing a crime interactions. Think about if the only time you saw a cop when you were younger was when your parents were taken from you and being arrested, the swat was out because another neighbor was dealing drugs, or someone down the street was murdered. This is what many inner city kids see daily. Then, even if they make it out of that environment without falling into the same trap, they will likely have a habit of hating the line of duty because every time they have had an interaction something bad is happening.
I do not know the answer, but I hope we didn't miss the opportunity to fix things.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:37 am to Oilfieldbiology
(no message)
This post was edited on 9/25/20 at 2:02 am
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:43 am to messyjesse
quote:
I don't think anybody should ever acquire an "extensive rap sheet." Someone on the road to an extensive rap sheet needs to be locked in jail for life or executed. That's how you clean up the streets.
I don't give a frick if the prisons are overcrowded. Build more prisons. I don't want criminals on the street.
Or actually look at how incredibly useless our prison system is. If you put people in jail and treat them like animals, they'll come out like animals.
Is prison supposed to help reform people and help them learn form their mistakes and put them in a position to come back to society and contribute and actually be a better person, or is it a place to just throw people into for a certain amount of time like animals until they're let back out?
I'm not saying it's one size fits all for everyone, because there are situations that call for long term sentences, and there certainly are those that are beyond help. But the current state of our prisons is that of a system that just churns through people, mostly young and black, and continues to harden them and keep them angry at the system that put them there without doing any sort of rehabilitation before sending them back out completely unprepared to contribute to society.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:43 am to Baws
I think we need to pay cops a lot more, have fewer of them, and raise the standards for becoming one. Create more demand for the profession and the quality will soar.
Obviously wouldn't work everywhere, but it would work in a lot of places.
And maybe don't spend money on militarizing them and instead create an avenue where they can get very quick assistance from National Guard if needed.
I am no expert though, just spitballing. I know it is a classic HR strategy to increase quality by reducing spots and raising pay.
I think 10 great, very smart and well-trained cops are better than 20 GEDs with a chip on their shoulder from not getting a football scholarship our of high school.
Obviously wouldn't work everywhere, but it would work in a lot of places.
And maybe don't spend money on militarizing them and instead create an avenue where they can get very quick assistance from National Guard if needed.
I am no expert though, just spitballing. I know it is a classic HR strategy to increase quality by reducing spots and raising pay.
I think 10 great, very smart and well-trained cops are better than 20 GEDs with a chip on their shoulder from not getting a football scholarship our of high school.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:44 am to Sneaky__Sally
quote:
ETA: The entire system needs reform at every single level, education, police, criminal justice, economics / working conditions. But we are stuck with two old fricks with no new ideas as our presidential candidates after like 30 years of the same old bullshite which has gotten us into this mess.
Wanting the federal government to be involved in local law enforcement is a disaster waiting to happen.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:46 am to Oilfieldbiology
I’m pretty sure we have heard about this happening in small towns... Just a guess, maybe there are less people around to video something like that happening? If you get pulled over and harassed on a road without a 20 witnesses, why even report it??? Your word against theirs. Maybe a smaller police department is an more tight nit group??Officers who grew up together are more likely to defend each other or sweep something under the rug??? Again, it’s likely a whole lot more difficult to come out against the police in a smaller town that you live in. You would have a target on back. Word gets around quick.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:50 am to Baws
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:51 am to Baws
I want to apply for sfpd.
Brpd has many issues. The Arab plcop who shot at someone then lied about it. The black cop who ran into a car and killed a baby.
Brpd has many racist white cops
Brpd has many issues. The Arab plcop who shot at someone then lied about it. The black cop who ran into a car and killed a baby.
Brpd has many racist white cops
Posted on 6/1/20 at 10:52 am to Baws
BR needs more cops, cops with better pay, and cops making way less overtime. We need better candidates, better training, and less stress and too many hours leads to a stressed out cop
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:01 am to doubleb
(no message)
This post was edited on 8/8/20 at 8:36 am
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:02 am to DiamondDog
quote:
Hey. How about you take a glock, run around the city in BR responding to every distress call, deal with your life constantly being in danger, then have some crackhead point a cell phone in your face twice a night yelling WorldStar.
Then let’s talk about “police reform”. How about criminal reform? Like don’t commit fricking crime.
I'm with you 100%. Cops have an insanely hard job, but I still think something needs to be done to prevent things like what happened to George Floyd from happening. When that very rare occurrence happens the police lose all credibility. It's a sad skewed perception, but something needs to happen to prevent this.
If President Trump announced some kind of police reform it might actually start to bring the country together. People may feel like their voices are being heard and it may actually unite the country.
I have no clue as to what the inner workings of police departments are, but there has to be something to make people feel like a change is being made. Stricter training. Higher pay. Strict demotions/firing. Rewards for reporting abuse of power from a fellow officer. (Seriously, why didn't one of those officers stop and say "okay we got him handcuffed, get off his neck, lets get him in the car"). Renewed physical fitness tests. Harder admissions standards. Scheduled Police involved School, & Community events to build trust. Have a required education class on the proper way to interact with the police, and what your rights are as a citizen.
Again, I don't know shite about police work, but it seems like some sort of police reform,even if its just minor changes would go a long way for public perception and officer accountability.
This post was edited on 6/1/20 at 11:04 am
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:06 am to Baws
quote:
We should open up the hiring pool for cops, do away with petty things like lie detectors if a cop ever smoked Marijuana, he can’t be hired.
There are these things called police unions that prevent any sensible reforms. These unions are creations of the left. Ever wonder why cities with majority black citizens, black mayors and black dominated city councils can't reform their police departments?
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:06 am to kage
quote:
Or actually look at how incredibly useless our prison system is. If you put people in jail and treat them like animals, they'll come out like animals.
Very true as well.
We need to do the following to reduce recitivism:
- Drastically reduce/remove prison sentences for non-violent drug users. They just go to prison and it fricks their lives up and they basically go to criminal school while inside.
- Fund a lot more work release and professional training programs for prisoners that will be released one day.
- Fund a lot of therapy sessions for prisoners that will be released one day.
- Find the really bad apples in jail and separate them forever from the prisoners that have any hope of improving their lives.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:07 am to TexasTiger39
Working long shifts and a ton of OT whether it’s for the city or on the side is a recipe for trouble, We need to pay our people and put them on a forty hour work week. 5/8s of 4/10s. Corral working on the side. Limit it somehow. I’m no expert, but these kind of conversations need to be had.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:11 am to Penrod
BR has a black mayor and a black police chief, if they are too incompetent to hire the police force they want, resign. Civil Service or not, that's their job. Don't blame white people or Trump. Police Unions can be bypassed if you bother to document the violation and take appropriate action.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:13 am to Pintail
Think about the entire country and how often these Floyd type events actually occur. It’s minuscule comparatively.
They occur but I refuse to believe we need to blow up an entire system for a handful of outliers.
You want a higher quality of cop on the street, I’m all for it. Make the entry test harder. Qualifications stricter.
You assume better pay equates to better candidates but that’s patently false assumption. If they started paying septic cleaners $100k, would educated folks migrate to cleaning shite out? Doubtful.
The work attracts a type of candidate. You want better police procedure, fine. But there is no wholesale reform that is going to mitigate these outlying circumstances that are largely dependent on individual discretion and circumstance.
What is largely going to happen is a migration out from the police force as there becomes stronger scrutiny and more control about how to engage suspects under volatile conditions.
Just my opinion but likely.
They occur but I refuse to believe we need to blow up an entire system for a handful of outliers.
You want a higher quality of cop on the street, I’m all for it. Make the entry test harder. Qualifications stricter.
You assume better pay equates to better candidates but that’s patently false assumption. If they started paying septic cleaners $100k, would educated folks migrate to cleaning shite out? Doubtful.
The work attracts a type of candidate. You want better police procedure, fine. But there is no wholesale reform that is going to mitigate these outlying circumstances that are largely dependent on individual discretion and circumstance.
What is largely going to happen is a migration out from the police force as there becomes stronger scrutiny and more control about how to engage suspects under volatile conditions.
Just my opinion but likely.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:13 am to jsquardjj
quote:
This is a reform that should have happened a long time ago. Obama didn't do it. Trumps not doing it.
Neither is the Pope. Do want to blame him, too? These are local issues for local governments. Trump and Obama have/had little sway on this.
Posted on 6/1/20 at 11:15 am to andouille
quote:
BR has a black mayor and a black police chief, if they are too incompetent to hire the police force they want, resign. Civil Service or not, that's their job. Don't blame white people or Trump. Police Unions can be bypassed if you bother to document the violation and take appropriate action.
Treating the cops right is not a priority. Grocery stores, express bus routes, NBR, and helping her friends is what she’s all about, That and milking SG taxpayers.
She had a study done which she has not acted on. She had been too busy fighting the virus.
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