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Message
re: Venial Sin my butt!
Posted on 2/16/24 at 7:55 pm to Guntoter1
Posted on 2/16/24 at 7:55 pm to Guntoter1
quote:
Go talk to Saint James. Ask him his opinion and then come back and tell us what he said.
I’m guessing you’re referring to faith without works is dead? In regards to Sola Fide? Please, excuse me if I’m missing your point. I often see this argument between Catholics and Protestants, about faith vs works salvation. They always seem to put James and Paul against each other- when they actually complement each other. Faith without works is dead, and works without faith are unable to save.
James 2:14 (NASB95): 14 ?What use is it, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but he has no works? Can that faith save him?
James 2:17–20 (NASB95): Even so faith, if it has no works, is dead, being by itself.
18 ?But someone may well say, “You have faith and I have works; show me your faith without the works, and I will show you my faith by my works.”
19 You believe that God is one. You do well; the demons also believe, and shudder.
20 But are you willing to recognize, you foolish fellow, that faith without works is useless?
What does Paul say?
Ephesians 2:8–10 (NASB95): 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.
Do we have a contradiction? Absolutely not! We are saved by grace. Through faith. For good works! No works- no faith. No faith- no grace. No grace- no salvation. One without the other is useless. Like kool aid with no sugar.
When I compare these scriptures, I realize that James and Paul are speaking to two different audiences. James is speaking to a bunch of Willy nilly Protestants, who have deceived themselves with “cheap grace.”
Paul is talking to a bunch of Roman Catholics, who think that walking around with ashes on their foreheads on Wednesday and skipping the steak on Friday is going to get them into Heaven. 
Both are speaking to those of us who
Matthew 15:8–9 (NASB95): 8 ‘… honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far away from Me.
9 ‘But in vain do they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the precepts of men.’ ”
Please, forgive me if I have offended any of you- Catholic or Protestant. That was not my intention.
3
Posted on 2/16/24 at 7:59 pm to Prodigal Son
quote:
Please, forgive me if I have offended any of you- Catholic or Protestant.
I want to eat bacon, catfish, beef, shrimp, crabs, lobster, and such
We cool.
Posted on 2/17/24 at 11:02 am to Guntoter1
quote:Prodigal covered it already.
Go talk to Saint James. Ask him his opinion and then come back and tell us what he said.
Perhaps you should let us all know where James made a mortal/venial distinction regarding works.
Posted on 2/17/24 at 11:25 am to Cheese Grits
Wow three religion threads on page 1 of the poli board. Are the old days back?
Posted on 2/17/24 at 12:44 pm to Cheese Grits
Sin is sin. Mortal and venial are man-made doctrines (Catholic Church)!! Read your Bibles. No such thing in there about categories of sin.
Posted on 2/17/24 at 12:51 pm to bamafan1953
The Bible is man-made.
Posted on 2/17/24 at 1:14 pm to Mo Jeaux
quote:God’s word in man’s words, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.
The Bible is man-made.
Posted on 2/17/24 at 2:05 pm to Prodigal Son
quote:
Please, forgive me if I have offended any of you- Catholic or Protestant. That was not my intention.
Then why call them
quote:
a bunch of Willy nilly Protestants
Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.
Which is the law to do works.
Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.
If you account your righteousness by your good works of being obedient to the law, you are not under grace.
A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.
Even if you use a portion of the law (10 commandments) to justify your "goodness". It is not by grace.
Galatians 5
Posted on 2/17/24 at 2:11 pm to Cheese Grits
Its like having a Christian religion and teaching Jesus didn't die for our sins/mistakes.
Posted on 2/17/24 at 6:21 pm to Pikes Peak Tiger
quote:
No meat on Friday but gorge yourself on shrimp, crawfish, crabs, fried fish etc.
Include alligator in with “etc.”
According to the Catholic Church, an alligator is a fish therefore not “meat”.
Posted on 2/17/24 at 6:27 pm to Cheese Grits
quote:Yeah - that's why we had nasty fish sticks in the lunchroom on Fridays.
Mortal = knowingly eating meat on Friday
Posted on 2/17/24 at 6:48 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
Christ paid the price for all of our sins
Foo, who exactly did Christ pay? Who was it that demanded payment? Why couldn’t the recipient of the payment forgive sins without someone having to die, if the recipient of the payment is all-powerful? Was Christ’s death really a true sacrifice if he was brought back to life?
Posted on 2/17/24 at 6:49 pm to LSUbest
quote:
Then why call them quote: a bunch of Willy nilly Protestants
I’m guessing you’re offended. Do you think that I meant that all Protestants are willy nilly? Far from it, my friend. I’m referring to the type of “believers” that James was referring to. The people who think that they can simply repeat a prayer, show no change in character or behavior, and expect salvation. That faith, is dead faith. Neither James, nor I, are saying that your works will secure salvation. What James says, and I agree with, is that if you claim to be a follower of Jesus Christ- your actions and behaviors will bear witness to your faith. Not because you have to, but because you genuinely want to. It is a labor of love. Not for salvation, but because of your salvation.
Paul agrees:
Ephesians 2:8–10 (NASB95): 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.
We are, I think, on the same team. I apologize if you found my locker room humor offensive.
Posted on 2/17/24 at 7:25 pm to Cheese Grits
quote:
Says you.
Uh. Says the Catechism.
Posted on 2/17/24 at 7:27 pm to Tbone2
quote:
Protestants put their faith in a Bible codified by the Catholic Church more than a 1600 yrs ago
Yes, crazy that they crap on Catholics and consider them to be non-Christian. It’s completely hypocritical and flat stupid.
quote:
1200 yrs before the Protestant Churches.
That brings up another good topic. Many Protestants including some here are of the incorrect belief that the Catholic Church added some scriptures to the canon very late. It is the Protestants- starting with Martin Luther- that ripped out who books and parts of others out of the already existing canon.
Posted on 2/17/24 at 7:53 pm to Cheese Grits
What does Venial Sin have to do with Politics?
Here's the Catholic explanation and how it's covered in The Bible.
LINK
Here's the Catholic explanation and how it's covered in The Bible.
LINK
This post was edited on 2/17/24 at 7:58 pm
Posted on 2/17/24 at 7:54 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
God’s word in man’s words, under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.
Let me ask you something, Foo:
When Jairus approached Jesus about his daughter, was he daughter alive, but ill, or was she already dead. Tell us what the Holy Spirit says about that. Put on a mental gymnastics show for us.
I’ll make it easy on you, and provide a reference to others…
Mark 5
quote:
21And when Jesus had crossed again in the boat to the other side, a great crowd gathered about him, and he was beside the sea. 22Then came one of the rulers of the synagogue, Jairus by name, and seeing him, he fell at his feet 23and implored him earnestly, saying, “My little daughter is at the point of death. Come and lay your hands on her, so that she may be made well and live.” 24And he went with him.
Matthew 9
quote:
18While he was saying these things to them, behold, a ruler came in and knelt before him, saying, “My daughter has just died, but come and lay your hand on her, and she will live.”
Those are irreconcilable contradictions. Either the daughter was alive, or she was dead when Jairus approached Jesus. Those are not two different points of view. Which one is right, and which is wrong? Which one did the Holy Spirit inspire?
Why didn’t the Holy Spirit continue to preserve originals and inspire accurate translations into other languages?
Posted on 2/17/24 at 9:33 pm to Squirrelmeister
quote:
Those are irreconcilable contradictions. Either the daughter was alive, or she was dead when Jairus approached Jesus. Those are not two different points of view. Which one is right, and which is wrong? Which one did the Holy Spirit inspire?
“We got Him now!”
Is the difference between “at the point of death” and has died” really that important? Does it alter the outcome of the event? No and no. You do know that ancient literature was not as concerned with word for word accuracy in quotation, as we are today, right? Of course you do. But that type of admission does not bode well for your semantic arguments and misdirection attempts.
quote:
Why didn’t the Holy Spirit continue to preserve originals and inspire accurate translations into other languages?
So people like you could feel confidently justified in your rejection of Jesus Christ, and not be intellectually forced to accept that which your hardened heart freely despises- surrender to God.
Posted on 2/18/24 at 1:23 am to Squirrelmeister
quote:God the Father. The debt of sin that is owed by sinners is owed to the Father, whose justice we deserve. Christ's death satisfied God's justice for sinners, and that satisfaction is applied to sinners by faith in Christ's sacrificial work on the cross on their behalf. If you trust in Jesus' death for sin, then His righteousness will be imputed to you and your sins will be pardoned.
Foo, who exactly did Christ pay?
quote:Due to His just nature, God the Father demands payment for sin.
Who was it that demanded payment?
quote:Because omnipotence isn't the only attribute of God. God is also holy and just, and His justice requires payment for sin.
Why couldn’t the recipient of the payment forgive sins without someone having to die, if the recipient of the payment is all-powerful?
quote:Yes. God became a man to die when He didn't deserve to (because He didn't sin). He suffered, was tortured, abandoned by those whom He loved, and bore the full wrath of His Father for the sake of sinners.
Was Christ’s death really a true sacrifice if he was brought back to life?
It was a true sacrifice.
Posted on 2/18/24 at 1:31 am to Squirrelmeister
quote:No thanks. I could explain away these alleged contradictions like I've done many times in the past and you'd just ignore them and move on to others, only to circle back to these again in a few months. It's a futile effort. I'd rather share the gospel with you, since only if you are given eyes to see and ears to hear will you understand the truth.
Let me ask you something, Foo:
Jesus Christ is the son of God, who shares one essence or being with the Father and the Spirit, and to whom is all honor and allegiance is owed as Lord of lords and King of kings.
This God took on a human nature in order to be the perfect sacrifice for sin. He had to be God because only God could provide a sacrifice for sin that was of infinite value to pay for all sins of all God's people. He had to be a human in order to be a sufficient representative for humanity.
Jesus obeyed the law of God perfectly, doing what man could not or did not do prior, and therefore fulfilled the covenant of works for us. His sacrificial death satisfied the wrath of God against sin and earned righteousness for sinners so that we can stand before God as guiltless and holy for eternity with everlasting life as the fulfillment of the covenant of grace. This salvation from the penalty of sin is received only by faith, which is a trusting and resting in Christ's work alone for a right standing with God.
Repent of your unbelief and trust in Jesus to take away the guilt of your sin, and you will be saved.
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