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Message
re: Jalen Rose: Analytics are racist
Posted on 6/6/19 at 7:58 pm to GeauxTigerTM
Posted on 6/6/19 at 7:58 pm to GeauxTigerTM
quote:
But is it racist when some sports nerd tells a white baseball player that his numbers are not as good as he may think they are?
In reality, who is the racist in this scenario?
0
Posted on 6/6/19 at 8:06 pm to Fun Bunch
1. Almost every coach in the NBA has played at least at the college level.
If he's talking about GMs, then yeah, it takes more than just playing the game to be a general manager.
2. Is he suggesting that white people are smarter? I mean, there is nothing stopping black guys who have math degrees from joining an NBA front office. Analytics isn't a white only thing.
3. Analytics guys were hated for a long time by everyone from players to coaches to established front office personnel. The reason they are in such demand now is because their ideas have proven to work. They're not just giving analytics guys jobs to gain power over black players. That's asinine. They're getting jobs because their ideas have won out. They help win basketball games for an organization.
4. Jalen Rose is a moron. And he's probably one of the "smarter" players. So if he's a moron, think about how moronic most other players are. I mean, just listen to Barkley and Shaq talk basketball. Most players have the IQ of a shoe. Barkley and Shaq are proof that you can play basketball at a high level and not have a clue about the game of basketball from a coaching standpoint... and certainly not from a GM's standpoint.
If he's talking about GMs, then yeah, it takes more than just playing the game to be a general manager.
2. Is he suggesting that white people are smarter? I mean, there is nothing stopping black guys who have math degrees from joining an NBA front office. Analytics isn't a white only thing.
3. Analytics guys were hated for a long time by everyone from players to coaches to established front office personnel. The reason they are in such demand now is because their ideas have proven to work. They're not just giving analytics guys jobs to gain power over black players. That's asinine. They're getting jobs because their ideas have won out. They help win basketball games for an organization.
4. Jalen Rose is a moron. And he's probably one of the "smarter" players. So if he's a moron, think about how moronic most other players are. I mean, just listen to Barkley and Shaq talk basketball. Most players have the IQ of a shoe. Barkley and Shaq are proof that you can play basketball at a high level and not have a clue about the game of basketball from a coaching standpoint... and certainly not from a GM's standpoint.
This post was edited on 6/6/19 at 8:14 pm
Posted on 6/6/19 at 8:13 pm to Baloo
quote:That is absolute nonsense.
I wouldn't say analytics are racist, but they are anti-labor. They don't have to be, numbers are numbers after all, but the whole point of analytics is to get the maximum amount of production for the least amount of dollars. The reason everyone talks about market inefficiencies is because you are trying to find things that help you win without having to pay full value for it.
So players should rage against analytics when they can. It's taking money out of their pockets, particularly in baseball where we've seen the collapse of the "middle class" and contracts for over 30 players on top of service time manipulation to prevent players from reaching their full earning potential on the front end of their careers. Star players are the big winners, but the rank and file players get hosed.
Looking at analytics, some players that once would get paid big bucks wouldn't anymore... like Carmelo Anthony. Analytics showed what he really was.
Yet other players, like 3 and D role players, are getting paid a lot of money now when in the past they would have been nobodies. Analytics proved they are worth way more than traditionally thought.
And the analytics show that some star players, like LeBron and Durant, should actually be making way more money than they currently are.
So your premise about analytics being anti-labor is absolute nonsense. Analytics have raised many players up that would not have been paid a nice salary in the past. Now, these role players can point the the analytics when it's time to negotiate their contracts and show that they are worth way more than their traditional box score numbers would suggest.
This post was edited on 6/6/19 at 8:16 pm
Posted on 6/6/19 at 8:15 pm to PrimeTime Money
quote:he posts this take seni regularly. It's not worth arguing with him over it
So your premise about analytics being anti-labor is absolute nonsense
This post was edited on 6/6/19 at 8:16 pm
Posted on 6/6/19 at 8:53 pm to Fun Bunch
Jalen Rose is part of the worst panel ever assembled. I hate ESPN's NBA panel..
Posted on 6/6/19 at 9:11 pm to PrimeTime Money
The Durant/LeBron level players don’t benefit from analytics though because there’s nothing they can do with that. There are salary caps and/or max salaries that they are already at.
Now in the Nba, since salaries are tied to a percentage of the Cap, the analytics revolution hasn’t hurt the players. There have been more losers than winners in baseball.
Now in the Nba, since salaries are tied to a percentage of the Cap, the analytics revolution hasn’t hurt the players. There have been more losers than winners in baseball.
Posted on 6/6/19 at 9:17 pm to ReauxlTide222
quote:if their record was 3-5 and the ERA 6.00 they'd be all about the analytics if it said something they like
young players are just trying to bust their arse and be proud of their 7-2 record and 3.4 ERA.
Posted on 6/6/19 at 9:37 pm to Ross
Posted on 6/6/19 at 9:39 pm to Fun Bunch
Well, it is math...
Posted on 6/6/19 at 10:51 pm to Keys Open Doors
quote:Many big name players were vastly overpaid before. Players are now being paid what they are worth.
There have been more losers than winners in baseball.
Posted on 6/6/19 at 10:57 pm to PrimeTime Money
quote:
Many big name players were vastly overpaid before. Players are now being paid what they are worth.
So who gets the money, the owners? Aaron Judge makes 500,000 and is one of the best players in baseball how is that fair? Analytics is most definitely about keeping costs down that’s why in baseball young players are in demand. They’re subject to service time manipulation and arbitration and don’t make what they’re worth
Posted on 6/6/19 at 10:59 pm to Fun Bunch
Anyone: Why do you think that, Jalen? What facts do you have to back your position?
Jalen: Racist.
Jalen: Racist.
Posted on 6/6/19 at 11:05 pm to ChanceOfRainIsNever
quote:that has nothing to do with analytics
Aaron Judge makes 500,000 and is one of the best players in baseball how is that fair?
quote:and once again, the fact that the rookie players are paid what they are has nothing to do with analytics. But mainly, I think it proves the point. The owners will always look for ways to pay players less. They use analytics as a tool to stop giving out ridiculous deals. But its just that, a tool. It can be used however anyone wants to use them
Analytics is most definitely about keeping costs down that’s why in baseball young players are in demand. They’re subject to service time manipulation and arbitration and don’t make what they’re worth
Like in the 60s, you know what the owners were using to keep players pay down? RBIs, average, pitching wins, etc. Are analytics more anti labor than those? I dont think so
Posted on 6/7/19 at 12:15 am to Fun Bunch
A rich negro call math racist, this should be good.
Posted on 6/7/19 at 12:41 am to Baloo
quote:
I wouldn't say analytics are racist, but they are anti-labor. They don't have to be, numbers are numbers after all, but the whole point of analytics is to get the maximum amount of production for the least amount of dollars. The reason everyone talks about market inefficiencies is because you are trying to find things that help you win without having to pay full value for it.
So players should rage against analytics when they can. It's taking money out of their pockets, particularly in baseball where we've seen the collapse of the "middle class" and contracts for over 30 players on top of service time manipulation to prevent players from reaching their full earning potential on the front end of their careers. Star players are the big winners, but the rank and file players get hosed.
Do you understand how a market economy works?
Posted on 6/7/19 at 12:46 am to ChanceOfRainIsNever
quote:
So who gets the money, the owners? Aaron Judge makes 500,000 and is one of the best players in baseball how is that fair?
You can thank the players’ union for that one.
Analytics is about identifying production with limited resources. That’s it. It’s a more advanced version of what organizations have been doing since the beginning of sports.
Posted on 6/7/19 at 12:55 am to Fun Bunch
Goldennugget and lsupride are both spreadsheet analytics guys. Both white.
Coincidence? Maybe, maybe not............
Coincidence? Maybe, maybe not............
Posted on 6/7/19 at 1:07 am to PrimeTime Money
quote:
Looking at analytics, some players that once would get paid big bucks wouldn't anymore... like Carmelo Anthony. Analytics showed what he really was.
Yet other players, like 3 and D role players, are getting paid a lot of money now when in the past they would have been nobodies. Analytics proved they are worth way more than traditionally thought.
And the analytics show that some star players, like LeBron and Durant, should actually be making way more money than they currently are.
So your premise about analytics being anti-labor is absolute nonsense. Analytics have raised many players up that would not have been paid a nice salary in the past. Now, these role players can point the the analytics when it's time to negotiate their contracts and show that they are worth way more than their traditional box score numbers would suggest.
Well said.
Posted on 6/7/19 at 2:33 am to High C
quote:
Billy Beane invented racism in pro sports. Who knew?
Derek Jeter has as much experience with being a star athlete and winning championships as any professional athlete on the planet. Does anyone expect him to do with the Marlins what the analytics staff in Houston did with the Astros? They made a big deal out of him going to hoover and watching the kid from vandy play. Anyone that has any clue about baseball can watch them play and say, “that kid is really good!”
But if jeter can put together a team to win the World Series based on the eye test, well, he’s the best front office man in the business right now.
This post was edited on 6/7/19 at 2:35 am
Posted on 6/7/19 at 8:13 am to TbirdSpur2010
I think Rose was saying that the white owners are using analytics as a convenient excuse not to hire black coaches and GMs. The problem is former players don’t have any experience using, and applying analytics which are now so important to the game. They don’t really have the needed experience until they get in the administrative world and work with the analytics.
As far as analytics are anti-labor is a bunch of crap. All it’s done is adjust people’s view of what should be valued vs what was valued in the past. Years ago, no one talked about efficiency in basketball...they would just think it was awesome a player scored thirty points, that player didn’t get dinged for taking 25 shots to get that 30.
As far as analytics are anti-labor is a bunch of crap. All it’s done is adjust people’s view of what should be valued vs what was valued in the past. Years ago, no one talked about efficiency in basketball...they would just think it was awesome a player scored thirty points, that player didn’t get dinged for taking 25 shots to get that 30.
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