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re: Rewatching Game of Thrones has confirmed my original thoughts.
Posted on 10/15/24 at 9:41 am to Tiger1242
Posted on 10/15/24 at 9:41 am to Tiger1242
Arya killing the NK was horrible. All those seasons of build up, for a dark battle that ends with one swing and every main character is running around with the thickest plot armor imaginable.
Should have had everyone move south to fight Cersei, have Jamie kill Cersei in the battle of KL, Danny dies in dramatic fashion somehow, and then everyone remaining turns north to fight the WW. Jon kills the NK to save humanity in an epic battle sequence with the help of Bran, and everyone rallys behind Jon to become the next ruler.
Should have had everyone move south to fight Cersei, have Jamie kill Cersei in the battle of KL, Danny dies in dramatic fashion somehow, and then everyone remaining turns north to fight the WW. Jon kills the NK to save humanity in an epic battle sequence with the help of Bran, and everyone rallys behind Jon to become the next ruler.
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Posted on 10/15/24 at 10:48 am to Tiger1242
quote:Did she really though?? She learned to sweep the floor. She learned to wash dead bodies. And then she pretty much just got her arse kicked by the Waif until she left for Westeros. Admittedly, she did kill the Waif by using the dark but what else did we really see her learn. Certainly didn't see her learn enough to beat Brianne, a formally trained warrior who was able to beat the Hound.
I mean someone had to kill him and she has been training to be an assassin literally the whole series
Posted on 10/15/24 at 10:54 am to AUCom96
quote:
This take I don't get. In the books, she was nuts and tyrannical... just in a benevolent way when it suited her. When challenged, she had a clear tendency to go scorched earth and the weapons to do so. Like everything with that show, it was too rushed and compressed to the point of being absurd, but that's pretty much the path I expected her to go down to one degree or another.
It’s far down the list of issues, but narratively it’s just very frustrating after she spent 7 seasons basically doing the same plot over and over to prove she was different as a targ and had compassion, just to throw it in the trash at the end because they needed more twists for the finale
They didn’t really build it up or do anything interesting with it, and the plot line completely sidelined Jon Snow from doing anything remotely interesting the last two seasons
In a vacuum that twist can work, they just didn’t put any of the work in to earn it
This post was edited on 10/15/24 at 10:54 am
Posted on 10/15/24 at 11:14 am to SouthEasternKaiju
quote:
Would be nice if Jon could face the Night King again and Arya could have taught him that neat knife drop trick but goodness, we can't have anyone stealing HER agency!
Arya is bastardized in the show. They should have used her wragging into the wolf and eating Lannisters every few episodes after the red wedding or random letters to king's landing about a pack wolves slaughtering soldiers. It wouldn't have broken their budget, of all the cuts from the show that is one that bothered me the most.
Like everything else in the late seasons, her story is rushed and hollow.
Martin was setting it up that she'd never be a faceless man and always a stark but the show rushed it.
Posted on 10/15/24 at 11:35 am to Jax Teller
quote:
Night Kingslayer and redemption.. That's how you bring a character arc home. This wasn't that fricking hard.
Posted on 10/15/24 at 11:40 am to SouthEasternKaiju
quote:
Geroge is too stubborn and proud to do either, so sadly, fans have gotten all they ever will from him on this story.
Hope the dude stubs his pinky toe every day for the rest of his miserable life.
Posted on 10/15/24 at 12:04 pm to statman34
quote:
Most of the Stark reunions at Winterfell were good
Sansa's homecoming and reunion with Jon is very moving.
YouTube 1:22
This post was edited on 10/15/24 at 12:05 pm
Posted on 10/15/24 at 12:15 pm to StansberryRules
quote:
it's obviously better than the Bran thing. It's hard to fix any one issue in a vacuum when there are like 25 major things wrong simultaneously
Bran was always going to be King.
theres a reason he is the intro POV in the first book and breaks his legs and becomes the 3 eyed raven. Him becoming King was George's plan.
I understand that it was underwhelming to people who haven't read the books though.
Posted on 10/15/24 at 12:22 pm to Tiger1242
The first five seasons are still some of the best television I’ve ever seen. Once it was obvious they were out of source material it fell off so fast and far.
Their inability to at least conclude the show at bare minimum competently shows how untalented the writers and showrunners are.
This may be the weakest generation of writers we have ever had. The amount of big budget productions that are amateurishly awful is remarkable.
Rings of Power being the latest. And in their case they have one of the richest fictional worlds to work with.
Their inability to at least conclude the show at bare minimum competently shows how untalented the writers and showrunners are.
This may be the weakest generation of writers we have ever had. The amount of big budget productions that are amateurishly awful is remarkable.
Rings of Power being the latest. And in their case they have one of the richest fictional worlds to work with.
This post was edited on 10/15/24 at 12:23 pm
Posted on 10/15/24 at 1:09 pm to Tiger1242
quote:
I didn’t mind the way the night king died really, I mean someone had to kill him and she has been training to be an assassin literally the whole series
I mean it doesn't get much dumber than not even having the Night King and Jon have some sort of show down. Even more build up for Arya being an assassin was the build up of Jon fighting the Night King. To have the Hardholm episode and then not have some fight between the two is just inexcusable.
Arya was my favorite book character by far and my favorite show character. I'm fine with her doing cool stuff, but she had no previous drama with the Night King. It was ridiculously dumb to have her be THAT much of an assassin and even worse having her be a faceless man. She did not finish her training, she was not a faceless man. She gave that up so she could be/stay a Stark. Yea it was pretty cool to see her get revenge on the Frey's, but it was completely ridiculous to do it in the way that she did, it completely undermines the faceless men/her whole storyline there.
Also, she hadn't been training to be an assassin the entire series.
This post was edited on 10/15/24 at 1:12 pm
Posted on 10/15/24 at 1:17 pm to Triple Bogey
quote:
Should have had everyone move south to fight Cersei, have Jamie kill Cersei in the battle of KL, Danny dies in dramatic fashion somehow, and then everyone remaining turns north to fight the WW. Jon kills the NK to save humanity in an epic battle sequence with the help of Bran, and everyone rallys behind Jon to become the next ruler.
Dude, who cares about Jon. We need to make sure GREY WORM is happy. Freaking Grey Worm.
Grey Worm who proceeds to immediately leave and take his army to a place that will with certainty kill them
Aww yay Grey Worm is happy, that's all that matters, who cares about the central figure of the show. Then let's have him sail off to the place his love was from... except that the isle is filled with butterflies that are poisonous to everyone but the natives and outsiders only survive there for a few hours. Freaking retarded. 
Posted on 10/15/24 at 1:43 pm to Triple Bogey
quote:
Should have had everyone move south to fight Cersei, have Jamie kill Cersei in the battle of KL, Danny dies in dramatic fashion somehow, and then everyone remaining turns north to fight the WW.
This is the way.
Bran being king wasn’t even that bad, it actually makes some sense. It’s really just the way they went about it
Posted on 10/15/24 at 1:57 pm to Corinthians420
quote:
Bran was always going to be King. theres a reason he is the intro POV in the first book and breaks his legs and becomes the 3 eyed raven. Him becoming King was George's plan. I understand that it was underwhelming to people who haven't read the books though.
I buy that theory and it’s why George will never finish the books.
Sam isn’t George’s admission based on George and is a self admitted craven.
George saw the massive backlash about bran and now will never finish the books.
Posted on 10/15/24 at 2:13 pm to Tiger1242
Dani was always bad. Even in the books. Just because she did good things didn’t make her somehow good. She just wasn’t as evil as Cercei.
She wanted to rule over others. They were not slaves but were still subjects to bow down to her.
If she went through it to set everyone free, then she was good, but she was trading one form of slavery for another.
It is much like the idiots in Britain that celebrate the royals. Those people subjugated them for centuries, and instead of destroying them, they prop them up as a symbol of positivity. That is the point. You can’t be “royal” and noble. To be royal means others have to be lesser and subjects.
That is why Dani was evil. She wanted the power over people but just played the game differently.
She wanted to rule over others. They were not slaves but were still subjects to bow down to her.
If she went through it to set everyone free, then she was good, but she was trading one form of slavery for another.
It is much like the idiots in Britain that celebrate the royals. Those people subjugated them for centuries, and instead of destroying them, they prop them up as a symbol of positivity. That is the point. You can’t be “royal” and noble. To be royal means others have to be lesser and subjects.
That is why Dani was evil. She wanted the power over people but just played the game differently.
Posted on 10/15/24 at 2:21 pm to Geauxgurt
quote:
That is why Dani was evil. She wanted the power over people but just played the game differently.
Attacking Kings landing made sense for her. Riding her dragon through the streets indiscriminately burning everyone and everything did not make sense, not without a lot more build up anyway.
Posted on 10/15/24 at 2:48 pm to Tiger1242
quote:
Riding her dragon through the streets indiscriminately burning everyone and everything did not make sense, not without a lot more build up anyway.
But it fits her character’s lust for power. She was never going to free the seven kingdoms. She was going to rule over them. The problem some of you have is believing that someone claiming their birthright to rule is somehow good. The only good would be to burn down the system and leave it to the people. She never planned for that in the seven kingdoms.
She was evil, albeit a lesser evil than Cersei. She just was better at shrouding it in her “good intentions and acts”.
Posted on 10/15/24 at 2:52 pm to Hayekian serf
quote:without a doubt; and I agree from my point of view- and I'm over 50. There have been many great TV shows, and I'd never seen something the quality of initial GOT.
The first five seasons are still some of the best television I’ve ever seen.
As an older guy, I do have to say- there's several distinctions. TV shows USED to be weekly, 25+ episodes a year. Modern "premium" shows are 8-10 episodes, and you might get a season yearly... or it might be further apart.
So it's more like what we used to call a 'miniseries'... stuff like Shogun, etc. And I think the original Shogun holds up well, as do some others. But then, you have the issue of multiple seasons. None of these miniseries ever attempted to go that long.
Problem is, most compelling storylines, be it a novel or something historical, give you a limited amount of onscreen moments before it gets stale or runs out of juice. Most can give you a movie (+/- 2 hrs), a few can give you a miniseries or several movies (6-12 hrs). LOTR for example, gives you about 12 hrs, and that was a book trilogy. If it had been a TV show today (HBO), you maybe can get to 15 yrs, including Bombadil and the Old Forest early, and Scouring of the Shire late.
Contrast- The Hobbit trilogy. They absolutely stretched that way too long, and had to insert a lot of extra stuff not in the book. It really should have been no more than, say, 4 hrs worth.
quote:I'm just going to disagree with you on this point. It's a very well-known and popular world, but you don't have a lot to adapt to screen, not for the period they chose. It's kinda like the Star Wars prequel trilogy- you have a few "history textbook" style paragraphs and notes, but no real dialog etc. You have to go from a point A, to a known point B by the end. That's actually tough to do, because it's hard to be both entertaining, and still go where you're supposed to go, because it's all going to be predictable.
Rings of Power being the latest. And in their case they have one of the richest fictional worlds to work with.
Posted on 10/15/24 at 3:03 pm to Geauxgurt
quote:
But it fits her character’s lust for power. She was never going to free the seven kingdoms. She was going to rule over them.
There's a difference between lust for power/wanting to rule and literally murdering a million people.
quote:
The problem some of you have is believing that someone claiming their birthright to rule is somehow good.
Whether you view her as good or not is kind of irrelevant. You didn't view her as good, that's fine, but you're basing that off a general rulership mentality. The show was portraying her as good. She was in no way on the way to becoming what they made her into. She was not a mad queen.
quote:
She was evil, albeit a lesser evil than Cersei. She just was better at shrouding it in her “good intentions and acts”.
And almost overnight she went from a lesser evil than Cersei to an evil that Cersei never came close to. She went from chaining up her dragons because they burned up one farmers kid to burning up a million innocent people after the battle was won.. all because Jon wouldn't bone her anymore.
Posted on 10/15/24 at 3:32 pm to Tiger1242
Sansa should have been the one to kill Baelish.
If you know the Night King can raise the dead, why hide in the crypts?
I needed the Stark sisters to learn of Jon's true identity ON SCREEN.
The Iron Fleet shouldn't be able to hide behind a large rock.
Jon leaves for exile without a single interaction with Sam (as I recall)???
Just my opinion, but these were a few of my issues with those last 2 seasons.
If you know the Night King can raise the dead, why hide in the crypts?
I needed the Stark sisters to learn of Jon's true identity ON SCREEN.
The Iron Fleet shouldn't be able to hide behind a large rock.
Jon leaves for exile without a single interaction with Sam (as I recall)???
Just my opinion, but these were a few of my issues with those last 2 seasons.
Posted on 10/15/24 at 3:36 pm to 615tider
quote:
If you know the Night King can raise the dead, why hide in the crypts?
This was the most obvious thing ever, especially since they went out of their way to mention the crypts 40 times.
Did not one single person ever consider the fact that they’re fighting the dead and putting their most vulnerable in a graveyard?
It was already obvious, and then when Arya gave Sansa the knife it became borderline comedy
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