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re: I’m torn on lonzo now
Posted on 2/10/21 at 9:01 am to shel311
Posted on 2/10/21 at 9:01 am to shel311
quote:
I'd imagine Lonzo would prefer a bigger role in running an offense as opposed to what he's doing now.
If that thought were to even begin to cross his mind, he has completely lost it. This is the best basketball he has played in his short career and its BECAUSE of his role hes playing the last several games. This is whats going to get him paid.
0
Posted on 2/10/21 at 9:03 am to Galactic Inquisitor
quote:
If they tighten up, Zion and BI will eat.
There is a very large space in terms of defensive adjustments a team can make between simply going under screens, selling out, and daring a guy to shoot open/lightly contested shots, to smothering him with a number one or two defender and over-helping off screens like a team would a prime Redick.
My point is we don’t really know yet if all it will take to tank Lonzo’s efficiency is some pretty simple adjustments that aren’t going to majorly affect the difficulty of Ingram/Zion’s life on offense.
This post was edited on 2/10/21 at 9:04 am
Posted on 2/10/21 at 9:07 am to Louisianabound88
Still not torn. Trade him without a doubt.
Not going to pay him like he’s our third best player, b/c he isn’t that good.
Tell me why he deserves more than KCP 3/$40?
Not going to pay him like he’s our third best player, b/c he isn’t that good.
Tell me why he deserves more than KCP 3/$40?
Posted on 2/10/21 at 9:34 am to bonethug0180
quote:Exactly! It is almost like people expect the defenses to just run off the court and let us do what we want. That is what we have been calling for to help Zion and BI.
That's EXACTLY what we want teams to do. If it gets to the point that teams are guarding him that tight at the 3 then that helps opens up the middle and makes the pick and roll game actually effective instead of a pointless dance.
That will also allow him to drive more off of picks as his guy gets too high and gives him space to get to the lane.
What you are suggesting is a bad thing is actually something we desperately need to happen
Posted on 2/10/21 at 9:38 am to Bronc
quote:Not paying him $20+ million for sure, but would be comfortable with $15 million. However, I do not think he takes that, so we should be looking to maximize his value via trade.
Of course if he could actually remain a threat in that capacity, but he actually has to prove it, and until he does I’m not willing to sign up for 15-20+ million to find out.
Posted on 2/10/21 at 10:04 am to Louisianabound88
It seems fairly clear that his younger brother’s early success and spotlight has motivated him to not be an after thought of the Ball family lol
Posted on 2/10/21 at 11:23 am to Shameless
Looking through Lonzo’s career stats rn
TS%
‘17-18: 44%
‘18-19: 49%
‘19-20: 52%
‘20-21: 54%
eFG%
‘17-18: 44%
‘18-19: 49%
‘19-20: 51%
‘20-21: 53%
FT%
‘17-18: 45%
‘18-19: 41%
‘19-20: 57%
‘20-21: 63%
Nice trends, even if starting from a poor base.
TS%
‘17-18: 44%
‘18-19: 49%
‘19-20: 52%
‘20-21: 54%
eFG%
‘17-18: 44%
‘18-19: 49%
‘19-20: 51%
‘20-21: 53%
FT%
‘17-18: 45%
‘18-19: 41%
‘19-20: 57%
‘20-21: 63%
Nice trends, even if starting from a poor base.
Posted on 2/10/21 at 11:31 am to Shameless
We've had an unfair assessment of Lonzo Ball. He's been a lead point guard his entire life, and in a contract year with no offseason and a new coach, we completely change his role. People went from hoping Lonzo make a three, to shunning him if he only made one.
It's very understanding that it took him time to adjust. Literally put another PG next to him and then say "the ball will run through BI and Zion, go shoot threes". The Pels did our guards no favors lol.
However he's adjusted, while also being our best defender. If he continues to improve in his role, resigning him will be considered. I think between the 15-20 mil range makes sense. If a team wants to pay him more, you just let him walk and continue to build around BI and Zion.
It's very understanding that it took him time to adjust. Literally put another PG next to him and then say "the ball will run through BI and Zion, go shoot threes". The Pels did our guards no favors lol.
However he's adjusted, while also being our best defender. If he continues to improve in his role, resigning him will be considered. I think between the 15-20 mil range makes sense. If a team wants to pay him more, you just let him walk and continue to build around BI and Zion.
Posted on 2/10/21 at 11:34 am to Shameless
Motivation isn’t an issue for him. He is a worker just like BI. I want players that will continue to get better on this team. I feel that because he was a bad free throw shooter he was reluctant to drive to the basket. The last few games he has looked more aggressive and it has helped this team tremendously. If he continues to play this way I don’t mind 20 a year. Anything above that makes me anxious though
Posted on 2/10/21 at 12:12 pm to Louisianabound88
I'm not torn at all. He is what he is. The slump will come just as fast as the hot shooting came. I don't hate Lonzo as a player, but I hate what he will demand on the open market.
Posted on 2/10/21 at 12:23 pm to Louisianabound88
Me too, his history is full of boom and bust cycles. Still not sure he's got the consistency in him.
Definitely can't afford to pay him what he's asking so do you get something for him now while his value may not be much higher?
Definitely can't afford to pay him what he's asking so do you get something for him now while his value may not be much higher?
Posted on 2/10/21 at 12:26 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:
Still not torn. Trade him without a doubt.
He's still "just" a 3 & D Wing. At $15 or less it's good value, at $20 or more he'll be like Harrison Barnes and Otto Porter, not good enough to be your #3 player but paid like it.
Posted on 2/10/21 at 12:26 pm to Spitting Venom
There is no stat you can show me to make me want Lonzo on this team for the price he will demand.
Last night there was a perfect example of his ineptitude that went mostly unnoticed, and won’t show up in stat that says anything.
He sped through two guys on a fast break, with one guard left to attack to get a layup. He hesitated before attacking and ultimately missed the layup, leading to an easy opportunity on the other end of the court as if we had turned it over.
Few minutes later Josh Hart has the same exact scenario happen, and flies right by the last defender and finished with ease.
There was a three minute span on the 2nd quarter where Lonzo missed 3 layups and took a step back jumper from just inside the 3 point line, 4 possessions in a row all without passing the ball one time in the offense. He’s too stupid to understand that when coaches and teammates tell him to be more aggressive, that’s not what they mean. He did this at the end of the Pacers game before shitting his pants and not calling a timeout, and costing us that game.
Lonzo will never be a creator b/c he has no idea how to finish in the lane. he is is a true 3&D guard with nothing else to his game, and there is nothing wrong with that. But that’s who he is, and seems like most people have a hard time accepting that, b/c they expect more from him.
Can anyone recall a time Lonzo took a charge?
Can anyone recall a time Lonzo went to the floor for a ball?
Lonzo is typically in the top 50 in the league in fouls per 36. You’ll find names like Jrue in there too but the reasons why Jrue and Lonzo have those similar stars are completely different. Lonzo did a great job not fouling John wall on drives last night, and he also did a shitty job stopping him from getting in the lane all night.
Last night there was a perfect example of his ineptitude that went mostly unnoticed, and won’t show up in stat that says anything.
He sped through two guys on a fast break, with one guard left to attack to get a layup. He hesitated before attacking and ultimately missed the layup, leading to an easy opportunity on the other end of the court as if we had turned it over.
Few minutes later Josh Hart has the same exact scenario happen, and flies right by the last defender and finished with ease.
There was a three minute span on the 2nd quarter where Lonzo missed 3 layups and took a step back jumper from just inside the 3 point line, 4 possessions in a row all without passing the ball one time in the offense. He’s too stupid to understand that when coaches and teammates tell him to be more aggressive, that’s not what they mean. He did this at the end of the Pacers game before shitting his pants and not calling a timeout, and costing us that game.
Lonzo will never be a creator b/c he has no idea how to finish in the lane. he is is a true 3&D guard with nothing else to his game, and there is nothing wrong with that. But that’s who he is, and seems like most people have a hard time accepting that, b/c they expect more from him.
Can anyone recall a time Lonzo took a charge?
Can anyone recall a time Lonzo went to the floor for a ball?
Lonzo is typically in the top 50 in the league in fouls per 36. You’ll find names like Jrue in there too but the reasons why Jrue and Lonzo have those similar stars are completely different. Lonzo did a great job not fouling John wall on drives last night, and he also did a shitty job stopping him from getting in the lane all night.
Posted on 2/10/21 at 2:39 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:Sorry, but your bias is showing through too much in these statements. You are cherry-picking individual plays in order to draw the conclusion you want. Anyone could pull a handful of plays from Zion, BI, Adams, Hart, etc, etc, and make a similar statement. Look at the overall game, not two or three plays that fit your agenda.
There is no stat you can show me to make me want Lonzo on this team for the price he will demand.
Last night there was a perfect example of his ineptitude that went mostly unnoticed, and won’t show up in stat that says anything.
He sped through two guys on a fast break, with one guard left to attack to get a layup. He hesitated before attacking and ultimately missed the layup, leading to an easy opportunity on the other end of the court as if we had turned it over.
Few minutes later Josh Hart has the same exact scenario happen, and flies right by the last defender and finished with ease.
There was a three minute span on the 2nd quarter where Lonzo missed 3 layups and took a step back jumper from just inside the 3 point line, 4 possessions in a row all without passing the ball one time in the offense. He’s too stupid to understand that when coaches and teammates tell him to be more aggressive, that’s not what they mean. He did this at the end of the Pacers game before shitting his pants and not calling a timeout, and costing us that game.
Lonzo will never be a creator b/c he has no idea how to finish in the lane. he is is a true 3&D guard with nothing else to his game, and there is nothing wrong with that. But that’s who he is, and seems like most people have a hard time accepting that, b/c they expect more from him.
Can anyone recall a time Lonzo took a charge?
Can anyone recall a time Lonzo went to the floor for a ball?
Lonzo is typically in the top 50 in the league in fouls per 36. You’ll find names like Jrue in there too but the reasons why Jrue and Lonzo have those similar stars are completely different. Lonzo did a great job not fouling John wall on drives last night, and he also did a shitty job stopping him from getting in the lane all night.
The issues with Wall getting in the lane early was not simply on Ball (how many can stay in front of Wall), but terrible help defense, mainly by Adams early.
Posted on 2/10/21 at 2:51 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:I just so happened to be perusing shot charts from last night and had it up when I read this post, so I looked it up.
There was a three minute span on the 2nd quarter where Lonzo missed 3 layups and took a step back jumper from just inside the 3 point line, 4 possessions in a row all without passing the ball one time in the offense.
Lonzo missed 2 shots at the rim the entire game, only 1 of those was in the 2nd quarter.
The span in the 2nd quarter you claim he went 4 possesions in a row without passing and missed 3 layups was likely a 5 possession span in which he missed 1 layup and 2 jumpers. The other 2 possessions were scores by NAW and a play where Zo drew a foul and hit 2 free throws.
quote:Wall is pretty darn good, and he defintely got a few over on Lonzo, but that's some serious bias you're showing if you can't concede that Lonzo has been really, really good on ball this season defensively.
Can anyone recall a time Lonzo took a charge?
Can anyone recall a time Lonzo went to the floor for a ball?
Lonzo is typically in the top 50 in the league in fouls per 36. You’ll find names like Jrue in there too but the reasons why Jrue and Lonzo have those similar stars are completely different. Lonzo did a great job not fouling John wall on drives last night, and he also did a shitty job stopping him from getting in the lane all night.
Posted on 2/10/21 at 2:57 pm to shel311
I don't care if Ball misses some layups right now. I'm watching his ability to get to the rim and get a good shot. Ball making those shots will come in time. His focus this year has been his mid range and we have seen the fruits of his labor as a result. When he starts really working on his shots within 3 feet,I'm sure you'll see improvements.
Lonzo is literally doing everything people here ask him to do and yet people still don't acknowledge his progression.
Lonzo is literally doing everything people here ask him to do and yet people still don't acknowledge his progression.
Posted on 2/10/21 at 2:59 pm to Billy Mays
quote:
What is a player comp for Lonzo once he's reached his peak? A better version of Marcus Smart?
A lesser version of Jason Kidd
Posted on 2/10/21 at 3:02 pm to supe12sta12z
Ball doesn't shoot much at the rim but surprising stat here, he's shooting 65.9% at the rim this season and that % has improved in each season of his career.
Posted on 2/10/21 at 5:05 pm to Tiger Ugly
quote:
Me too, his history is full of boom and bust cycles. Still not sure he's got the consistency in him.
You’ll sleep better once you realize this is 95% of the NBA, they just don’t operate under the microscope and scrutiny of a Lonzo
Then ya also realize Ball is 23, has played only 182 games, and is playing for his 3rd coach in 4 years
Posted on 2/10/21 at 5:13 pm to GynoSandberg
The good thing about Lonzo is that if his shot isn't falling, he's still giving you really good defense. If his shot is falling, he's very, very valuable.
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